College Discussion - View Single Post - Northwestern Economic major and Emory Goizueta business school,

NorCalDad · 05-09-2008, 10:01 PM

David,

As usual, the advice of Sam Lee is very sound and appropriate – look for a school that fits your academic needs and personal preferences.

I recognize that as a H.S. junior, your understanding of “financial job” is limited, but then again, that’s why you want to attend college – to broaden your knowledge base and extend your horizons. As someone who has been in corporate recruiting for over 20 years, I can assure you that “financial job” can have many meanings, from accounting positions to FP&A (financial planning & analysis) to SEC reporting to due diligence analysis to commercial banking or investment banking. Each of these functions requires specific skills/techniques, along with the necessary soft skills such as strong communications and interpersonal abilities.

I would urge you to not get too far ahead of the game. Know yourself first. Know what you want in a college experience. While you can (and should) have a plan for your future, you should know that many students change their minds mid-stream. This can occur from a newly-developed interest or a profound experience that truly stirs a passion previously hidden from your consciousness.

The choice (if you should be fortunate enough to have one) between Northwestern and Emory would be desirable, but understand that each of these two schools are highly-desired for good reason. Each is an elite national university with great resources, and each is highly selective (average unweighted GPA of admitted students for Emory this year was 3.84; average SAT Math/CR score was 1400+). Many excellent students were denied admission to NU and Emory this year, and it wasn’t for lack of being deserving.

If you do eventually have the choice presented to you, think ahead 4 years to what you will want to do with your life. I believe that the study of Economics is a good basis for the real world, and no doubt about it Northwestern is a great school for Econ. On the other hand, Emory/Goizueta B-School deserves its accolades for the facilities and programs that have been brought together. If you excel, regardless of where you attend school, the jobs you desire will find you. If you do not reach standards of excellence, it will not matter what school you will have attended. Either of these two schools will do the job – if you also do your job.

A couple of comments… although Sam Lee indicates that the undergraduate Certificate Program for Undergraduates from Kellogg is competitive, it is yet to be weighted very highly. It’s a “nice to have” at this point, but it’s too early to suggest that it will be a difference-maker to most prospective employers, depending on the jobs they need to have filled. An Econ degree from Northwestern alone can be as valuable to many employers, assuming you’ve demonstrated a conscientious effort during your u/g years. The essence of the certificate program can be gained as easily by applying yourself to the necessary critical thinking and quantitative techniques you can develop in other NU courses. On the other hand, you need to know what kind of career you want to develop – if, for instance, you are seeking an accounting career, this certificate is not as valuable for that purpose. If you want a career in financial analysis, it might be. This is a choice that you will make AFTER you’ve applied to NU, been ADMITTED, and then shown yourself to be an excellent student during your first 2 years, AND still want to pursue a career applying quantitative techniques to the complex problems the world has to offer.

As for the comments of “hotasice”, I would ignore them. He speaks with a dubious understanding, and it’s reprehensible for him to make statements about Goizueta that lack substance and corroboration. Regarding his comments about NU’s Kellogg School, understand that this is a school whose acclaim is based on their graduate programs – something that you may aspire to perhaps 10 years from now (average age of Kellogg MBA student is 28 years old), and if your career aim is say in Marketing, where Kellogg excels. The tie-in of Kellogg to NU’s u/g Econ major is minimal.

Ultimately, the school you attend is unimportant if you do not perform well and realize your potential to think critically, apply layered analysis, communicate well and persevere against all obstacles. The major advantage, in my mind, with an Economics focus is that it will offer you the opportunity to do this – so long as you are diligent. The advantage of a BBA is that it is liked by many employers as evidence for solid knowledge of specific business-related techniques/practices. Public accounting firms (e.g., KPMG, Deloitte, Ernst & Young and PwC) like BBA’s that are trained in Accounting – and they certainly have a high demand in the aftermath of the Enron scandal and recently-enacted legislation such as Sarbanes-Oxley. If getting a good job in Accounting is your aim, you can do so by attending a solid school such as Santa Clara University, getting an internship between your junior/senior years and getting a job offer well before you get your BBA. Before you embark on this path, though, ask yourself what you want… in a college experience, in a potential career, or even in lifestyle (many students from California have suffered depression in colder climates – flip-flops may be common in CA year-round, but that isn’t the case in most of the country).

I’ll end my post with the story of somebody I spoke with this week. She thought she knew what she wanted in life. She was (and still is) a smart young woman, savvy, living a good life in NYC. 10 years ago, after graduation from Wharton with a degree in Economics, she was interviewed and offered a position by JP Morgan Chase in their Investment Banking group. She accepted and spent 3.5 years experiencing the life (if you can call it that) of an Investment Banker, until she realized she wasn’t happy (in fact, she had no life for all the demands of investment banking). When she went back to school at age 26, she was fortunate to be accepted into Harvard’s MBA program (at an opportunity cost that she estimated to be about $300K – no salary/bonus at $125K per year, plus the cost of attending a 2-year full-time program). She experienced the compelling event she had been seeking – an internship with Kraft Foods, that gave her a taste of brand management and consumer-based marketing. Upon graduating from Harvard, she took a position with American Express in NYC, initially managing credit card brands. Today, she has had 4 years of marketing experience and enjoys her role as a global marketing manger for AMEX. She will tell you that her earlier career in IB was not a waste of time (and it ultimately caused her to think hard about what she really wanted in her life), but the true value of her experience is that she now knows how important it is to be true to yourself, even if it requires a serious attitude adjustment and ensuing career change.

(BTW, as an aside, Jamie Dimon, the CEO of JP Morgan Chase also has a Harvard MBA, but he studied Biology and Economics as an undergrad at Tufts.)

05-09-2008, 10:01 PM	#6
NorCalDad Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Threads: 4 Posts: 658	David, As usual, the advice of Sam Lee is very sound and appropriate – look for a school that fits your academic needs and personal preferences. I recognize that as a H.S. junior, your understanding of “financial job” is limited, but then again, that’s why you want to attend college – to broaden your knowledge base and extend your horizons. As someone who has been in corporate recruiting for over 20 years, I can assure you that “financial job” can have many meanings, from accounting positions to FP&A (financial planning & analysis) to SEC reporting to due diligence analysis to commercial banking or investment banking. Each of these functions requires specific skills/techniques, along with the necessary soft skills such as strong communications and interpersonal abilities. I would urge you to not get too far ahead of the game. Know yourself first. Know what you want in a college experience. While you can (and should) have a plan for your future, you should know that many students change their minds mid-stream. This can occur from a newly-developed interest or a profound experience that truly stirs a passion previously hidden from your consciousness. The choice (if you should be fortunate enough to have one) between Northwestern and Emory would be desirable, but understand that each of these two schools are highly-desired for good reason. Each is an elite national university with great resources, and each is highly selective (average unweighted GPA of admitted students for Emory this year was 3.84; average SAT Math/CR score was 1400+). Many excellent students were denied admission to NU and Emory this year, and it wasn’t for lack of being deserving. If you do eventually have the choice presented to you, think ahead 4 years to what you will want to do with your life. I believe that the study of Economics is a good basis for the real world, and no doubt about it Northwestern is a great school for Econ. On the other hand, Emory/Goizueta B-School deserves its accolades for the facilities and programs that have been brought together. If you excel, regardless of where you attend school, the jobs you desire will find you. If you do not reach standards of excellence, it will not matter what school you will have attended. Either of these two schools will do the job – if you also do your job. A couple of comments… although Sam Lee indicates that the undergraduate Certificate Program for Undergraduates from Kellogg is competitive, it is yet to be weighted very highly. It’s a “nice to have” at this point, but it’s too early to suggest that it will be a difference-maker to most prospective employers, depending on the jobs they need to have filled. An Econ degree from Northwestern alone can be as valuable to many employers, assuming you’ve demonstrated a conscientious effort during your u/g years. The essence of the certificate program can be gained as easily by applying yourself to the necessary critical thinking and quantitative techniques you can develop in other NU courses. On the other hand, you need to know what kind of career you want to develop – if, for instance, you are seeking an accounting career, this certificate is not as valuable for that purpose. If you want a career in financial analysis, it might be. This is a choice that you will make AFTER you’ve applied to NU, been ADMITTED, and then shown yourself to be an excellent student during your first 2 years, AND still want to pursue a career applying quantitative techniques to the complex problems the world has to offer. As for the comments of “hotasice”, I would ignore them. He speaks with a dubious understanding, and it’s reprehensible for him to make statements about Goizueta that lack substance and corroboration. Regarding his comments about NU’s Kellogg School, understand that this is a school whose acclaim is based on their graduate programs – something that you may aspire to perhaps 10 years from now (average age of Kellogg MBA student is 28 years old), and if your career aim is say in Marketing, where Kellogg excels. The tie-in of Kellogg to NU’s u/g Econ major is minimal. Ultimately, the school you attend is unimportant if you do not perform well and realize your potential to think critically, apply layered analysis, communicate well and persevere against all obstacles. The major advantage, in my mind, with an Economics focus is that it will offer you the opportunity to do this – so long as you are diligent. The advantage of a BBA is that it is liked by many employers as evidence for solid knowledge of specific business-related techniques/practices. Public accounting firms (e.g., KPMG, Deloitte, Ernst & Young and PwC) like BBA’s that are trained in Accounting – and they certainly have a high demand in the aftermath of the Enron scandal and recently-enacted legislation such as Sarbanes-Oxley. If getting a good job in Accounting is your aim, you can do so by attending a solid school such as Santa Clara University, getting an internship between your junior/senior years and getting a job offer well before you get your BBA. Before you embark on this path, though, ask yourself what you want… in a college experience, in a potential career, or even in lifestyle (many students from California have suffered depression in colder climates – flip-flops may be common in CA year-round, but that isn’t the case in most of the country). I’ll end my post with the story of somebody I spoke with this week. She thought she knew what she wanted in life. She was (and still is) a smart young woman, savvy, living a good life in NYC. 10 years ago, after graduation from Wharton with a degree in Economics, she was interviewed and offered a position by JP Morgan Chase in their Investment Banking group. She accepted and spent 3.5 years experiencing the life (if you can call it that) of an Investment Banker, until she realized she wasn’t happy (in fact, she had no life for all the demands of investment banking). When she went back to school at age 26, she was fortunate to be accepted into Harvard’s MBA program (at an opportunity cost that she estimated to be about $300K – no salary/bonus at $125K per year, plus the cost of attending a 2-year full-time program). She experienced the compelling event she had been seeking – an internship with Kraft Foods, that gave her a taste of brand management and consumer-based marketing. Upon graduating from Harvard, she took a position with American Express in NYC, initially managing credit card brands. Today, she has had 4 years of marketing experience and enjoys her role as a global marketing manger for AMEX. She will tell you that her earlier career in IB was not a waste of time (and it ultimately caused her to think hard about what she really wanted in her life), but the true value of her experience is that she now knows how important it is to be true to yourself, even if it requires a serious attitude adjustment and ensuing career change. (BTW, as an aside, Jamie Dimon, the CEO of JP Morgan Chase also has a Harvard MBA, but he studied Biology and Economics as an undergrad at Tufts.)