Keilexandra

^I'm not saying that the food isn't reflective of a "diverse student body"; I'm saying that it is reflective of institutional priorities. There are enough observant Jews at Brandeis that the school feels the need to prioritize their nutrititional requests, which is a perfectly fine position to take--but it's not a priority that I agree with, and therefore I am not applying to the school. As an atheist, I disagree with any institutional positions relating to religious practice, when those positions impact other students (i.e. not just kosher options, but all dining halls being kosher or nearly-kosher).

ncram65

As someone else said, all information is useful. And I do think that looking at percentage of kids receiving financial aid is useful in this regard. Rich kids don't get financial aid (I hope!). But adding that percentage to percentage of kids from private schools really waters down the usefullness of the financial aid data.

First, not every kid that goes to private high school is well off. (The affluent private high schools hand out a lot of scholarship money and those scholarship kids, if they've done well, are highly sought after by the selective colleges.)

Also, a lot of the private schools aren't close to wealthy to begin with. Colleges do a lot of diversity recruiting in the urban parochial schools and I would think they show up as private schools. And finally, there's lots of very well off public high school students in the applicant pool of expensive private schools.

I actually hadn't seen mimi's entitlement index when I first posted. but when I looked at it I was AMAZED at the identity of some of the schools that according to the index are significantly less entitled than Williams. Schools that I know from first hand experience have rip roaring, beer drinking, fraternity dominated, who's got the nicer car, be there or you're square social scenes that are the only thing to do on Saturday night.

So I'd say, be careful w/ that index because for whatever reason, it doesn't do what it says it does.

OldbatesieDoc

Wow, I'm amazed that we are still finding more to say about the Preppy Issue.Can I stir the pot again? Probably not, I've said my piece(s), but I'd like to point out that Amherst has the most posts on the P word of any other LAC...

kwu

Because ignorance and false rumor are intolerable, and it is a noble pursuit to expose those who are under the false impression that they are well-informed for what they truly are.

OldbatesieDoc

Whoa Kwu, watch the name-calling. You MUST be a non-preppy Amherst grad.
I thought Vossron's actual prepster data said it all, really...

GA2012MOM

Kwu is actually a current student and classmate of my D, who has always provided a fair perspective from an informed current students POV.

kwu

It's deeply troubling when prospective and admitted-and-considering students arrive on campus with false preconceived notions in their head, ones that will negatively color how they perceive Amherst--to the extent that they become completely and utterly close-minded to everything else, and solely attentive to this one damning, illusory quality, the only thing that matters in the end.

"Oh, I keep hearing that Amherst is preppy; I don't want to go to a school that's preppy" *crosses Amherst off the list without a second thought*

I suppose Amherst would be better off without these people who make life-changing decisions based on the spurious opinions of others, but considering that Amherst is trying very, very hard to help non-traditional and disadvantaged students feel welcome and embraced on campus, OldbatesieDoc, you are causing more harm then you realize.

'rentof2

Kwu, all the positive posts in this thread from people who have had a direct experience of the school tell the tale. A few posts from a couple of people with no direct experience of the school just aren't going to carry much weight. But I guess they serve a purpose in a way because they got those of us who know what it's actually like at Amherst an opportunity to share that!

morandi

isn't it always preconceived notions which kill any sort of serious dialogue, or discovery? CC has its share of those who rely on, or perpetuate, so many of these notions about schools and those who inhabit them. some opinions may not even be based on any real, perceptual, experience at all. instead, it might be the case they are ideas simply implanted in one's head and accepted w/o investigation. in fact, it seems as a society we have this constant need to label so that we can quickly 'understand,' categorize, and move on. i've only visited amherst a couple of times and really don't know any students, so perhaps i have no business on this thread, but i suspect the admissions folks work hard at creating a place filled with smart kids who care about excellence and contributing to a vibrant community of learning. they will, hopefully, wear all kinds of different clothing, come from different backgrounds, and different places but, hopefully, what binds them is their common pursuit of relevant knowledge coupled with the desire to share and enjoy the residential college experience. nothing is perfect and amherst is no different. i say all this with a son attending another nescac school of the same size and reputation. thankfully, he did not pay attention to what others said he would experience while there. he finds most of the stereotypes thrown his way to be myths or exagerations and completely irrelevant to the larger picture of actively engaging in the serious business of expanding one's base of knowledge and experience. of course pettiness exists everywhere but i hope, and expect, those at amherst seek to rise above that sort of trait and, instead, engage all who have insightful thoughts and, especially, all who wish to replace preconceive thoughts with a different kind of knowledge.

OldbatesieDoc

Here we go again.I'm not being malicious, or trying to harm anyone. I thought, perhaps mistakenly, that it was ok to post both positive and negative opinions.I have said several times that Amherst is a great school, and they are apparently going out of their way to welcome many students from diverse backgrounds.But there will be preppies...If all we are supposed to post is positive comments, this forum will be useless.

bigkagi

I think my experience might be helpful here: I was an artsy/alterna/whatever kid much like the OP's daughter, and my first choice for college was Reed. My parents decided Oregon was much too far away, though, so I looked to the Northeast. I visited Brown, Vassar, and Bard, and looked seriously at Wesleyan. The people I met at Amherst -- despite their more "mainstream" clothes -- struck me as much more interesting. So I went to Amherst as an undergrad, and am glad I did.

I then went to grad school at the University of Virginia and held a faculty position at Union College. Amherst (in the '90s, anyway) was MUCH less preppy than UVA or Union. Keep in mind that Amherst (officially, and for the most part actually) has no fraternities. That in itself reduces the preppiness considerably. But, more importantly, Amherst attracts lots of genuinely smart people from all over -- though they may not look as subcultural as the kids at, say, Bard, Hampshire, or Sarah Lawrence, they're actually much more likely to be the sort of people who actually think for themselves.

That said, there _is_ a preppy element there, coming out of the Northeastern private schools, and when I first arrived on campus I was a little put off. Some were -- to use the current argot -- genuinely ******y. But pretty soon I found my niche and completely forgot that those people were even there -- and found that many of them were actually pretty weird, original thinkers, underneath the uniform.

Plus, if you really feel like you need a dose of anti-preppiness, Hampshire is always right down the road! I definitely knew some people who went to Amherst for the classes but socialized all around the five colleges -- it's an option you don't have at, say, Williams.

samej860

haha. oldbatesiedoc, why don't you put spaces after your periods? Interesting.

OldbatesieDoc

Well, because I am not a typist. But that has nothing to do with my feelings about preppies and Amherst.
bigkagi, good post.