leo187um

^^
I've heard that many ppl quit after a couple years after they get their certifications and go to industry where they will make more money or go to another acct firm at a higher position.

I've never really heard of many ppl gettig fired from the firm, given that their not a lazy bum that does no work.

taxguy

Well, Leo187um, now you have heard about it.

southpasdena

They definitely do lay people off. They look to hide it. Take a look at deloitte's lip service about 2% layoffs when there have already been 2 previous rounds of layoffs just this year to "right size" their headcount. More like 5% plus. YET they hire the same number of grads. Weird huh. Next you have PWC doing the same thing, and the other 2 soon to follow. Bad planning amongst partners

taxguy

Southpasdena, it isn't bad planning among partners. The Big Four always had a policy of "up or out." If you can't make partner or they don't feel you are partner material, they either want you to leave or they will lay you off. This way they get a constant stream of motivated people who might be partnership material. Frankly, if folks knew that they won't make partner, how motivated and hard working will they be?

I should note that there are a few positions that they keep for "permenant managers." These are people who are VERY competant and work hard but won't make partner for one reason or another. Usually it is because of their personality. However, these few select folks might have some skills that the firm deems very desireable and , thus, won't be layed off. However, they are the small exception.

southpasdena

These people you speak of are directors.

And what we are experiencing is not the up or out policy. It is beyond that. It was and still is bad planning by the firms. You really need to look into this. I cannot see how you can deem yourself credible as a leader on this forum for accounting if this news is slipping you by

taxguy

SouthPasdena, What "news" are you referring to? I already noted that Big 4 do lay people off. Thus, what have I missed or not explained correctly?

ybernstein

I'm not sure whether to major in accounting or finance. I don't really have any intention of being an accountant for the long term, and am strongly considering law school. My original thinking for going into accounting over finance is that it gives me more opportunity in the general business realm if I choose not to go for law, or even if go for law. Basically my question is if I don't want to be an accountant should I major in it over finance?

taxguy

ybernstein, no one can really answer that question for you. However, I will say that generally accounting will open more doors than that of any other business major. In addition, it is the language of business and will help you in a number of ways such as understanding tax law, financial statements, etc. It even will be a good background for securities analysis and finanicial planning. My son majored in accounting and got is masters in financial planning. Despite having students who were finance majors as undergraduates, my son graduated valedictorian from his graduate program. I honestly don't think that any business major, including finance,gives a better all around preparation for business than accounting. Perhaps I am in error,but, from what I have seen, this is my opinion.

rocco100

taxguy, how will the accounting profession in the United States be affected once the international financial reporting standards becomes adopted? and what will this mean to the current crop of accounting students and practioners? that is, more or less opportunity because of increased global competition, higher or lower wages etc.?

worrywart

Great question, rocco! And for those who are currently getting an undergraduate accounting degree, will their coursework prepare them for this change? I would imagine it will take a number of years for schools to update their curricula.

taxguy

Rocco, I really can't answer that. However, all professionals such accountants, lawyers, doctors etc., are well paid, in part, for their up to date knowledge! Frankly, the greater the changes in the law, the more needed knowledgable professionals will become.

I would guess that those accountants who try to keep up their skills will be in great demand. Thus, that don't keep up will fall by the wayside...

ferryboat10

The latest talk at SEC is implementing it later rather than sooner. 2014 is the rumor.

Even if you were to graduate under the old curriculum around then, you're not in entirely screwed. Many states require CPAs to take continuing education credits to keep up to date on new accounting regulations and practices.

2VU0609

The WSJ had a front page article about this last Friday indicating some multinational companies will begin to adopt international standards for SEC reporting as early as 2010 and U.S. based companies will switch by 2014. Over the course of my teaching career, publishers have moved from three year to two year cycles for new editions. I'm confident that textbooks will be ready to go and that CPE for educators and practitioners will be plentiful. There are bound to be some bumps in the road for everyone, however, since it's hard to teach old dogs new tricks.

aswedc

"Permanent managers" "Small exception"? Hah, just wrong, again. Been out of touch with public accounting for more than a decade I see.

These days directors are very, very common. It's a legitimate career path that plenty who aren't on track for equity partner choose.

aswedc

southpasdena, bad planning? Maybe if you assume the firms were planning on never having layoffs.

Look at the bottom line stats. The firms are quite profitable, revenue growth is still supporting promotions to the partner ranks in large numbers. From their perspective, this is just optimizing the size of the workforce to continue to maximize profit at any given time. Where's the mistake?