New ranking of B-school is out, let's talk about Master of Finance

anilag · 04-24-2009, 01:55 PM

The new ranking of best b-school, specialty: Finance --> Finance - Best Business Schools - Graduate Schools - Education - US News and World Report
As i noticed that many top US universities do not offer master degree in Finance, rather PhD or MBA. Is there a ranking for Master of Finance/MSF/Master of Finance Economics (NOT financial engineering)?
which schools offer better programs?
I know the job market is awful, but just wanna know how do industry/professionals' view towards this kind of Master degree in Finance (MFin/MSF)? have a better shot to land a job?
All ideas appreciated, thanks!

storch · 04-24-2009, 06:01 PM

Likely many will disagree with me, but I think that a masters in finance offers excellent preparation for finance work, actually better than that the MBA (assuming the schools are equal in quality). Also, the fact that it's only a year is nice. You actually get more depth in finance from the Mfin; however, you may pay a price later on in your career if you forgo the MBA, as the marketing and management credentials matter as you move up within an organization.

So, short to medium term I think the Mfin is more attractive, long term I give the nod to an MBA.

There is no credible ranking for the Mfin, but top schools include the following:

London Business School, MIT, Oxford, Cambridge, LSE, IE. (possibly in that order)

There are plenty of second tier schools that offer the degree as well (BC, Rochester, Vanderbilt, Florida, Imperial, UCL, TCD to name a few)

Princeton offers one as well, but it is really financial engineering for quant types, and should be lumped with the MFE schools.

To give you an industry perspective: my old boss (a department head at a major asset management firm) viewed the Mfin as superior to an MBA for pure finance work. Having said that, I think the MBA is generally more reputable in the US and might open a few more doors - of course it also takes longer and costs more. There are pros and cons to each, so it's really a question of what you want to do.

icebox4 · 04-25-2009, 01:04 AM

Just want to chime in with the characteristics of several names that popped up here:

Sure, Princeton MFin is hardly a purely financial economics program, but it's definitely not CMU or NYU financial maths too. It helps that Princeton's program is 2 years, and allows the students to take up to 10-14 electives courses, which you can mold into something less 'quantitative finance' if you please. Here's a good example: one of the core courses is in 'Corporate Finance and Financial Accounting' & one of the more popular courses is 'Corporate Restructuring'. I doubt that you can find that at purely quantitative finance programs.

MIT's program: not much data point on this one, since it will start accepting students this fall. But many people guess that it will be very quantitative (a la MIT!).. probably more so that what you'd expect out of a 'finance' program.

As far as recruiting goes, I know that LBS + LSE finance graduates place really well in the City, although the landscape might have changed in the past 12-18 months. Oxbridge trails a little bit, but very marginally (this is a debatable point, I only speak from casual observation).

I personally prefer MSF, since I don't like the softer subjects that comes with MBA programs. To add on storch's points about MSF weaknesses vs. MBA: MSF usually has a smaller class size per year -- while this helps student/faculty interaction, you end up having a smaller (and slower growing) network after graduation.

Benetode · 04-26-2009, 01:55 AM

I have an MFin from Tulane and can tell you that it definitely prepares you for finance work better than an MBA . At TU, in one calendar year you take more finance classes than an MBA with a concentration in finance will have taken over two years. It's a great stepping stone to structured products, equity research, and a PhD in Finance if that's the route you want to go. It's definitely respected in terms of a degree but it's not well known. People know MBA, but they also understand what a Master of Finance is as long as you don't refer to it as an MFin. There is an advantage if you don't have the work experience for an MBA but want to move into serious finance work straight out of school. I worked for two years before going back to get my MFin. The age/experience range for my class was 22 year olds straights out of undergrad to a 37 year old former floor trader who already had an MBA and wanted more specialized training. We had everywhere in between in our class. Both degrees certainly have their pros and cons.

anilag · 04-26-2009, 11:17 AM

Thanks, guys, really appreciate your inputs. Now i've a better pic. Personally i prefer MSF/Mfin since it really build better foundation for those really pursue a career in finance, rather than management. MFE/quantitative are good, i'm from engineering background, my maths is quite good, but just wanna shift to finance. Under such economical environment, i think MSF is more flexible, while MFE, one really need to go to place like the street/the city. The most important, i dunt wanna be a quant, instead, have a strong interest in asset management/investment.
BTW, anyone knows if it very hard for an engineering background international student with limited banking work experience (i received 2:1 degree with Hon in engineering under british system, CFA I, will go for L2 next year, couple months worked in a commerical bank and around half a yr for a securities firm as intern and fresh analyst, this is what i have) to apply for top tier MSF programs???
If anyone knows any good MSF/Mfin programs or anything like ranking (i need a rough idea like how many schools offer such programs and quality, too), please leave some words. thanks so much! Have a nice day.

storch · 04-26-2009, 04:28 PM

anilag;

re experience: it really varies from one school to another. At LBS/Cambridge they average six years experience for the mfin, and you need at least two to apply - so don't even look at those. At most others work experience is less important however, around 2/3 of the class at oxford/LSE won't have any full time experience. I believe MIT is somewhat like this as well. Of course the academic requirements are a bit higher - for ex. the average GMAT at oxford is a 730. Your CFA work will certainly help (gl with lvl two btw, I did it last year and it's a beast), and the little bit of experience you have could be considered a plus as well (depending on the school).
Engineering is quite popular as a background, as mathematical ability is the most important thing at the programs where experience is less weighted. Assuming you can ace the GMAT, you should be in good shape.

anilag · 04-29-2009, 06:36 AM

Thx, storch , i'll work hard on GMAT and hope my work experience helps (or may not)
hi, Benetode, you mentioned the pros/cons of Mfin and MBA, can you giv more details? like to work in IB, investment firms or asset mgmt firms, how's MSF/Mfin's chance to get front office positions? better than MBA?

RML · 04-29-2009, 11:14 AM

anilag

I don't get it why you're excluding Master's in Financial Engineering when it's almost equivalent to MSc Finance and offer the same kind of job prospects after graduation?

anilag · 04-30-2009, 12:54 PM

well, RML, I just wanna discuss about MSF here. Based on my understanding, MFE is mainly made for those who wanna be quants, with strong programming and maths skills. I did programming before, simply just not a fan of it, and as an engineering student, i do have strong maths fundation, but may not be equally good as those studied pure maths. MFE is not anything bad, especially if someone wanna work in capital market make some new products (derivatives...), but it is only good for a special group of people. Personally, i prefer to study general finance, with a bit more maths related subjects, but dont wanna be a quant. So, i'm searching for good schools offer MSF programs, comparing to MFE, with bit more in finance theory, bit less in programming.

anilag · 05-04-2009, 06:26 AM

hi, does anyone have inside information regarding MFin programs offered by Vanderbilt, Rochester, Illinois and JHU? just compared among them, which one is better?

hobofromdowntown · 05-05-2009, 03:02 AM

i would also like to know

also, claremont mckenna has started a new MFinance program.

mba_app_2010 · 05-07-2009, 11:20 AM

Given my lack of solid work experience (1.5 yrs.) I am likely applying to a top Masters Finance program. I have looked at Arizona (Eller), BU, Vanderbilt, and Cal - Haas (
Financial Engineering Masters). I like the fact that an MS Finance gives you a specialty and direct focus.....but that is just for me.

expecttofly · 05-08-2009, 12:41 PM

MBA - good general business knowledge
Finance-Engineering: (as mentioned) serious quants - live in financial center
MSc Finance - good technical finance skills good exposure to finance industry

Make your choice. For me I chose a 2 yr. basic MBA with a 3rd year Msc Finance.

expecttofly · 05-08-2009, 12:46 PM

Greetings mba_app_2010,
Where did you come up with this list of schools? I am particulalry curious about why you chose Eller? I am looking for a ranking level for Eller MMF degree but little luck.

Japher · 05-08-2009, 12:47 PM

how has that worked expecttofly?

I want to get into business/management consulting from the engineering sector and then move into VC/PE (stretch, but if not a start-up company in a lead role) and am working towards my MBA. I was thinking about getting a concentration in Finance, but might go with MS in Finance instead.

Thanks.