asmallchild

Are you really a physician? ER as the least grueling? ER has one of the highest burnout rates in medicine.

You want least grueling? Try derm, allergy, rheum, outpatient psych, radiation oncology, pathology, outpatient PM&R, etc...

ER is certainly less rigorous than neurosurgery but it certainly isn't the "least grueling" of all fields.

Princess'Dad

small child, you obviously need to be a bigger child to read. "least grueling as when you are off you are off" and 8 - 12 hour shifts.
Derm, allery, rheum...are not shifts, are maybe boring (but safe) so days are long. Few ER docs I have ever met don't love it. Fast alternating with slow than off.
I stand by what I said

asmallchild

Way to backtrack. Your post clearly said "least grueling". Nothing about shift work.

:eyeroll:

Bigredmed

I'm calling this one in favor of Princess'Dad...


small child read what you quoted exactly in post #61 of this thread.

Son of Opie

"I love how we measure the difficulty of everything versus brain surgery. Hey, it ain't brain surgery. I always wonder, what do brain surgeons say? 'Hey, it ain't like...trying to talk to women."-Jim Gaffigan

bluedevilmike

I've only ever shadowed one neurosurgery. The surgeon's favorite quote was: "Come on, team, it's not like this is brain surgery. [pause] Oh--it is?" He did this both when he was trying to compliment himself and when he was trying to scold other team members. "Oh, it's okay that you weren't paying attention, it's not like this is brain surgery. Oh, it is?"

Son of Opie

Sounds like he may have been a bit of a ******.

asmallchild

I did.

It's wrong. You are off when you are off in radiology. And in anesthesia. And in ophtho. And in derm. EM is definitely not the least grueling of all fields.

Princess'Dad

"work 8 to 12 hour shifts and are then off. It is the least "grueling" of all fields as when you are off, you are off."

Anesthesia has highest suicide/drug usage. Radiologists have nights shifts in addition to day shifts. optho gets called in at nights. Derm - ok you have me on that one - but pretty boring.

asmallchild

you think ER doesn't come with hazardous health risks? guess you haven't worked at an inner city ER then

you think ER doesn't come with night shifts? and weekend shifts? and holiday shifts? granted, radiology night float is a lot more mentally stressful. but many people would prefer sitting in the dark, quiet reading room than the hustling bustling emergency department

ophtho gets called in at night. yes, they do. it's also home call. which means if no one calls, you don't come in. conversely, on an ER night shift, you're sitting smack dab in the emergency room. whether there are patients or not. and there are always patients to see.

derm is pretty boring. yeah, i might agree with you on that one. at the same time, refusing narc-seekers and ruling out chest pain for possible MI for the thousandth time probably gets old too.

Princess'Dad

smallchild. Sounds like you are not ER doc. Most love it as between the hundred r/o chest pain, they get the chest pain due to knife stuck in chest - ie the adrenal rush. Don't get that in the others you mentioned. And NO call, period.
As to hazardous health risks, don't know of andy ER doc shot inner city, do know of NS shot in his office in NYC and another threatened in Georgia

asmallchild

Again, twisting the topic. We weren't talking about adrenaline rushes. We are talking about how grueling the field is. Granted, ER is better than a lot of fields but I'm just pointing out (correctly I might add) that ER is NOT the least grueling of all fields in medicine.

Burnout, exposure to hazards, needlesticks, HIV+ patients, etc... etc... are all part of the ER mixture. Sounds like you don't know too much about the field. I continue to question if you are a physician. Not too many docs use anecdotal evidence to prove their points (e.g. I know a NS doc who had diarrhea. NS must cause diarrhea)

Bigredmed

Look, "grueling" is a subjective term. And personality does matter.

While it's only anecdotal evidence spending more than hour or two looking at x-rays would make me want to slit my wrists. That'd be a grueling proposition for me. That's fine. I'm well aware that a great many physicians find pediatrics absolutely nerve wracking, let alone look forward to spending a night in the PICU which is my career goal. Yes, being in a rads reading room is calm and dark, but I'd really, really, really, really, really hate my life if I was a radiology.

The point here is that ER physicians have a luxury that most other fields of medicine don't. That luxury is that when they leave the hospital, they know that they're never going to get a call about one of their patients, they never have to worry about being "on-call". They can work their three 12 hour shifts a week and then forget about the hospital. If you're in any sort of outpatient setting with a stable patient panel, you're always going to be at risk for getting woken up at night for something. Your derm and optho docs, I've personally (oh noz! more anecdotal evidence) called those specialties to get clarification on medications for their patients being admitted to the hospital for other reasons while my resident and I were doing admit orders. Anesthesia, while generally getting the benefit of not having to think about the hospital once they hit the parking lot, doesn't get the benefit of having that known shift length...surgeries run long, schedules get backed up, patients crash post-op, all are common things that lead to long days. But with ER, generally, that shift is up, you're already working your way towards the door. Yes there are occasionally the need to stay with a patient beyond 12 hours, but it's unlikely to stretch into 14 or 16 hour days. Yes, no one is denying the shifts are more hectic than other specialties, but the overall balance extends well beyond that. Does that make ER 'least' grueling? Perhaps not, but the fact remains that those physicians have a lifestyle very unlike most other fields of medicine.

Health risks are present in every field. Needlesticks are a fact of life and every physician is going to take care of patients with drug seekers, HIV+ patients, and those with mental illness (maybe not mental illness for the neonatologists...but that's only if you don't include the parents).

Further, it's dubious that you, as someone with only 34 posts, question the credentials of another poster, one who as consistently over the long term provided ample evidence of his experience and given, clear, accurate advice and insight.

Princess'Dad

thanks big red. The coat does you well.
burnout probably is bigger hazzard in derm, radio, anesh -- maybe why large suicide rate.
The rest of hazards (HIV) probably actually higher in surgical field as is malpractice.
think smallchild is just that and should be ignored.

bluedevilmike

I was looking over the numbers. Apparently something like twenty health care workers have ever contracted HIV while in the line of duty, and they all happened within the first few years of the epidemic?