99899998

I was just curious about the following:

In general, at top schools, Asian Americans do not get preference under the affirmative action system because they do not count as an "under-represented minority." However, I noticed that Carleton is not as ethnically diverse as most top schools. Are Asian Americans given preference for admission to Carleton?

Thanks.

IceNine

Not to my knowledge. I am in fact offended. Attempting to play the race card to get into college is disgusting. Good day sir/madam.

1190

I hesitated jumping into this hornet’s nest but think 99899998 does has a right to ask the question. Today’s reality (without passing judgment) is one in which college admissions offices themselves “play the race card.” In the case of Asian applicants, this is usually to their detriment (although not always, prompting the question posed in this thread). The pending Jian Li lawsuit against Princeton charging discrimination probably best illustrates this. Even the U.S. Education Department’s Office for Civil Rights is now involved looking at the allegations more broadly. This recent review of the case/subject is worth looking at:
Inquiry Into Alleged Anti-Asian Bias Expands :: Inside Higher Ed :: Higher Education's Source for News, Views and Jobs

In general, Carleton has made no secret of its interest in building a diverse class. Asian Americans represent about 10% of those on campus (a smaller than average number for an elite school) although probably another 4% or so of the student body are Asian internationals (the total international presence on campus is moving closer to the 10% mark).

Will your race work to your advantage in applying to Carleton? Possibly. But probably only if you are also seen as a serious applicant felt to represent a good fit for the school. At the very least (for a change?) it should not work to your detriment.

Good luck.

IceNine

I would respectfully disagree with you 1190 but seeing as you chose to take an hilariously condescending tone, I will heartily disagree. Choosing to "play the race card" is never OK. As I remember Carleton does not require one to declare what race they are when they apply. (I am fairly certain to ask applicants to do so would be illegal.) It is not a legitimate question. It is an affront to everything institutions like Carleton have worked for in striving to create a fair admissions system and a diverse student body. (Note that the idea of a diverse student body has incredibly little to do with the race of the applicants, if you do not already understand that I will continue this discussion no further.) It is bad policy to let injustice stand because it is "Today's reality." The world is full of injustice and we know this. This does not mean that the current status quo is correct nor should be tolerated simply because it is the status quo.

mflevity

Even the Common Application has a section in which an applicant may indicate his or her race. It is optional, but most students fill it out. There is nothing illegal about that.

I think the OP has a legitimate question. Also, 1190 has some interesting points and there is nothing condescending about his/her tone.

To IceNine: I suggest you read The Gatekeepers by Jacques Steinberg. It's about Wesleyan--an institution similar to Carleton in many respects. Notice how the admissions officers evaluate candidates in context of their background...all aspects of it.

2legit2quit

Unfortunately IceNine,

a big part of diversity in the admissions process as a whole is race. an individual person's admittance will not be decided solely on race, but many institutions do try to bring up the URM population. if race wasn't a componant, the term URM wouldn't even be in existance.

BananaSandwich15

Some of the posts on here are humorous. I’m black and I’m certainly not making that a secret on my application. Yes being Asian can help. Check the box. Mention your heritage in passing if you want, but don't make a big deal about it. The officers will see it and do with it what they will.

IceNine

mflevity: My point on that one about the legality of asking for race was perhaps poorly worded. I meant that no one can make you check a box, it is optional. If your racial background is important or even if you just feel your race may put some context to your experiences I am all for it. I seriously question the morality of playing up or gaming your race for a college admission.

2legit2quit: Refer to the end of post 1.

Leshachikha

IceNine: What would you consider "playing up" or "gaming" one's race?

Most URMs who check that box, I presume, feel that their race or heritage does play a part in their lives and puts their experiences in context. Whether a person is the only black person in her wealthy suburban high school class or lives in the inner city where poverty is concentrated in minorities, she has had an experience with difference. I can conceive of few situations in the United States, which remains fraught with racial tension and inequities, where an applicant's race (whether white, black, Latino/a, etc) has not in some way affected her opportunities or, at the very least, her outlook.

Being small, Carleton can afford to peruse applications far more carefully than, say, the University of Michigan. An "add-ten-points-if-the-applicant-is-black" type system is not employed here (and rightfully so). I have confidence that the admissions officers have the ability to place all the facts about a candidate in proper perspective-- socioeconomic status, location, gender, and, yes, race. I also have confidence, given my interactions with my peers of color on campus, that Carleton will not admit anyone who is not qualified.

GPAs and SATs and other acronyms are not the only things a potential student can contribute. For a class of only 500 kids, it is important to have people coming from all walks of life with different perspectives to share. That might mean a white kid from rural Iowa, a Chinese-American boy from Houston, an international student from Ecuador, or a black American from suburban Boston is considered an asset to the class . But that doesn't mean the automatic exclusion of socio-economically privileged white folk-- if anything, they're still far overrepresented in a school like Carleton and the perspective of the community as a whole is skewed in that direction.

The bottom line: One's race will NOT get you into or keep you out of Carleton. Rather, it will be viewed as part of the total package, a way for admissions officers to piece together a picture of you-- your beliefs, your passions, and your experiences-- in order to build a class of diverse perspectives.

mflevity

Well said, Leshachikha.

dietcokewithlime

What exactly do you mean by qualified? Able to take a normal courseload and not fail out? The vast majority of people who come to Carleton are able to cut it academically, but honestly, I've met some not-so-bright people here, too, who had to leave after a year or whatever because they were struggling with most of their classes. Some of color, most not--a fair number of male athletes, though. I think it's pollyanna-ish to assume that Carleton admissions doesn't occasionally let in people who just can't handle the work.

There was some discussion about minority graduation rates earlier this year, African-American students in particular having a low graduation rate. Carletonian article is at The Carletonian: UPDATE: low retention rate remains source of concern for the college. I have no idea how many African-American men drop out because of academics, transfer to somewhere cheaper for financial reasons, or leave for social reasons, but I have to wonder if the admissions office doesn't do as thorough or honest a job at evaluating "fit" with some minority or low-SES applicants (whom it very badly wants to admit for institutional diversity) as it does with middle/upper-middle-class white kids. Carleton seems focused on building better support networks for students of color or low-SES when they get here, but perhaps some of these efforts need to be directed at the admissions phase to be more realistic about who is going to stay here and who is not.

limner

99899998, my impression is that Carleton is looking at the whole person during the admissions process--or at least as much as they can see of the whole person. And it seems that Carleton also strives to have a level of diversity--racial, socio-economic, geographic--without compromising their other criteria. So I don't think any group is given preference, necessarily, but I do think Carleton looks at all facets of a prospective student.

I'm pretty sure that being from Tennessee, as opposed to, say, Minnesota, more likely helped than hurt my son's admission chances. (He'll be a soph. this fall.) But I'm also sure that being "geographically diverse" or diverse in any other way only goes so far. You have to have the other stuff Carleton wants.

IceNine

Just in response Leshachikha's question. Playing up as in attributing a false sense of importance to. Gaming as in looking through the racial make up of schools to single out ones which have "favorable" ethnic make ups for the purpose of gaining admission. (e.g. What it would appear the OP is doing.)

Just wanted to clarify that. If anyone else has any questions for me on this please PM me, as I would rather not add anything further to this ridiculous discussion.