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Here's what it really takes to get into the Ivy League these days

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Replies to: Here's what it really takes to get into the Ivy League these days

  • lookingforwardlookingforward Registered User Posts: 22,488 Senior Member
    edited May 12
    Nah. Some "experts" know how fear sells, drums up business. And what side their bread is buttered on. (Nothing against the good ones. But so many have no college inside experience. Or their experience is decades past.)

    We've spent a lot of time on some CC threads worrying about the word "robotic." (And stereotyping- some who really don't know even advise Asian Am kids to not disclose tennis or violin. That's silly.) An accomplished kid is great. It's just that those accomplishments alone aren't what it takes. "Perfect" is more than stats and rigor.

    This isn't an "ethnic" issue.
    Don't fall for this kind of stuff.
  • tdy123tdy123 Registered User Posts: 203 Junior Member
    edited May 12
    @exlibris97 So, at the IVY where you were on the adcom, all other things being equal, they saw no difference between a kid with a 2160 and a kid with a 2370? Also, no difference between a 2400 one-and-done as opposed to a kid who took the SAT 4 times and super scored?

    Naviance data from son's HS shows an extremely high difference in IVY results between a 2160 and a 2370....
  • theloniusmonktheloniusmonk Registered User Posts: 343 Member
    edited May 12
    SAT scores are evaluated against race, gender, family context, so you can't just say compare two scores, unless you mean that those things are also constant. In that case, I can also tell you that my experience shows 2370 is getting in to more top schools than the 2160. A 2160 is like what 10-11 wrong, a 2370 is one wrong. I'm not saying the 2370 is getting in everywhere...though.
  • picktailspicktails Registered User Posts: 407 Member
    edited May 12
    My URM DD just completed junior year at Penn. She was accepted with a 4.7 (wtd) GPA, 2150 SAT and 32 ACT, plus 2 subject test with scores over 700. She has thrived there, amongst an incredibly diverse, highly intelligent community. When walking through campus you see a vibrant racially diverse community, wth a student body that is passionate, engaged and immersed in activities. She is part of a volunteer/mentoring group in inner city schools, a dance group, a theater group, and politics, plus works at the Kelly Writer's House. Everyone there has an infectious passion and personality that simply grabs you - THAT is what they are looking for. That "it" factor, something that stands out - not perfect scores. Her essay BTW was about drinking tea with her father.

    Also, no professional test prep, just Princeton Review books at home. Plus leadership positions - president of NHS, captain of cheer squad, multiple leads in plays, started her own tutoring company, worked at Goodwill because it mattered. Right now she is interning for a congressman in DC over the summer, and will spend fall semester abroad in Singapore. They want students who DO things, not simply score on tests.
  • londondadlondondad Registered User Posts: 1,977 Senior Member
    @theloniusmonk "A 2160 is like what 10-11 wrong, a 2370 is one wrong. I'm not saying the 2370 is getting in everywhere...though."

    I went back and looked at DD's SAT results and she got 11 wrong total on her best performance. It seems like 11 wrong (on a 3.5 hour test) may have kept her out of some schools (she was rejected or wait-listed by 9 schools and her applications looked pretty solid (perfect grades, interesting ECs and summer jobs). Doesn't really seem fair or equitable does it? It seems that her real fault was being born 5 years too late as London private school kids are no longer interesting enough for top schools.
  • TestingearlyTestingearly Registered User Posts: 280 Junior Member
    @foobar1 - Brown's statistic of accepting only 28% percent of students with perfect ACT scores really moderated my expectations for D's chances of getting into highly selective universities. After seeing all of D's results, I believe that statistic can also be viewed from the yield management point of view that Brown may waitlist/deny the perfect score students because Brown feels they will be accepted into HYPSM and not attend Brown.

    Because of the exponential growth in international applicants, I am not convinced that it is harder to get into an Ivy now than it was 10 or 20 years ago. I would love to see the numbers broken down between domestic and international applicants.
  • PurpleTitanPurpleTitan Registered User Posts: 9,690 Senior Member
    edited May 13
    @londondad: About Brits not bothering to apply to American colleges outside the Ivies even though the educational system may be a better fit for them than the British systems:

    One thing is that most people just aren't very aware of colleges on other continents outside the very top. Almost all Americans would know of Oxbridge. Many of LSE, and some of Imperial/Edinburgh/St. A's. Not much knowledge (outside of academia and global prestige industries) of the rest.
    Another is that they may not appreciate not only the plethora and diversity of higher ed in the US but also that our private elite unis have smaller undergraduate student bodies. With the US having 5 times the population of the UK and our privates typically smaller (and of course the LACs are tiny), as a proportion of the population, all 30 schools I have as Ivy-equivalents (http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-search-selection/1893105-ivy-equivalents-ranking-based-on-alumni-outcomes-take-2-1-p1.html) offer as many slots as just both of Oxbridge.
    And while the range in the UK from Oxbridge to KCL encompasses about 10 unis, a similar range in the US would include about 40 research U's and 50 LAC's.

    BTW, UMich (as well as some other unis and LACs) are pretty generous about granting credit for A-Levels (and you don't even need high scores). So if someone who went through an A-Level system wanted to graduate from college in 3 years in the US, they likely could.
  • londondadlondondad Registered User Posts: 1,977 Senior Member
    ^ Thanks. Good point on the A-Level credits. I was not aware of that until my son registered for class at Miami. Hos school gives between 6 and 10 credits for each A2 result (the higher credits are for STEM subjects), and he received 24 credits for 3 A2's and 1 AS.
  • machiavelli1738machiavelli1738 Registered User Posts: 43 Junior Member
    @encadyma I did Student Government in 10th&12th grade. I am also part of HOBY which is a service-oriented leadership program. If you have any more questions, lmk!!
  • obbay1obbay1 Registered User Posts: 2 New Member
    edited May 15
    "Just try your best in school, learn for the sake of gaining new and exiting knowledge, and cross your fingers. At the end of the day, colleges are a business and do not guarantee a successful life. You do that yourself"
    - this bears repeating, so I did.

    I am a parent, closing in on retirement age, and I can tell you that in the real world going to a big name school might open some doors for you, but it does not guarantee success. That is an American Dream Myth.
    Also, don't expect life to be fair, it is not.

    One day you may find yourself in your 50's , in a high position with great pay and great benefits, only to be laid off . too young to afford retirement but too old (and expensive) to hire or retrain. didn't happen to me, but I've seen it happen a lot.

    On the other hand, you may also find yourself in your 50's and starting a new career by choice.

    don't paint yourself into a corner and try to be flexible. be nice to everyone you meet on your way up the ladder. pursue what you love, not just what you think will sound good.

    find a school where you can thrive, not just survive.
    and most importantly, have a great life!
  • foobar1foobar1 Registered User Posts: 139 Junior Member
    Brown does disclose in the "Common Data Set" that academics are of the highest importance in their admission process (CDS C7). However, "Talent" and "Personal Qualities" are of equal importance. I think talent means ability at the regional, national or international level. Not just the best at an individual high school.
  • shanabanana1shanabanana1 Registered User Posts: 255 Junior Member
    I only had half of these things and I was accepted into multiple ivy league schools.
  • swaggyb22swaggyb22 Registered User Posts: 26 New Member
    i don't know I had a weighted 4.4 in high school and got rejected to every single ivy with a 30 on my ACT. I also took 7 ap courses and got at least 4s on the exams
  • shanabanana1shanabanana1 Registered User Posts: 255 Junior Member
    edited May 16
    @swaggyb22 I got into two ivies with a 4.3, a 32 ACT, and 3s on most AP exams. You can't really depend on numbers in college admissions.
  • justverycuriousjustverycurious Registered User Posts: 33 Junior Member
    Any HYP-C athletes out there from a niche sport (ie squash, golf, fencing, archery, etc) who were recruited by coach, but either got rejected or accepted by the admin com? What were the academics stats that got them admitted or rejected?
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