Pizzagirl

Why would anyone care what Joe on the Street thinks? I would only care what "connoisseurs" (for lack of a better term) think. And they'll know the top LACs.

Joe on the Street's knowledge base is familiarity and football. Joe on the street doesn't really KNOW why Harvard's good - he's just heard all these years that Harvard is a school for smart people, so he repeats that.

Davidabb84

I'm sure most of this has already been said, but here's what I think.

1. They are almost always smaller than Universities. Therefore they'll have less of an impact outside of their area, less notable alumni, etc.

2. Universities are more likely to engage in big-name research activities, bringing attention to them. On-campus events are also much more likely to be shown on the news because of their size.

3. Universities tend to have better funded sports teams that are more likely to be Division I teams. As unfortunate as this may be for small schools, having good sports teams significantly increases the level of recognition.

xiggi

Why Joe SixPack drinks Bud Light and not Westvleteren XII. The fact that both are Belgian but a world apart in quality and reputation is not important to him. The reputation comes from watching football or waiting for a NASCAR pile-up.

Not much different for colleges.

PS I seriously doubt that many know much about the research that takes place at "big name" schools. They just assume it exists and is relevant. Just like they believe Fat Al invented the Internet and is saving the planet.

goldenboy8784

Ken Starr (Whitewater Scandal anyone?), Gerard Louis-Dreyfus (French billionaire and father of Elaine on Seinfeld, Tucker Max (infamous playboy), Charlie Rose (hosts Charlie Rose Show on PBS and CBS This Morning), Drew Rosenhaus (one of the most famous football sports agents), and John Adams (Co-Founder of the NRDC) are all pretty famous too.

That Gallup poll tells you how parochial the views of Americans with regards to what they consider to be the best universities in the country but it doesn't really inform us what schools are thought of as just being plain good at the very least nationwide. The question prompt asked to the survey respondents would have to be phrased differently to ascertain that information.

For instance, I suspect the reaction to someone graduating from Wisconsin-Madison would range from a shrug of the shoulder to "that's a good school". Similarily, a nationwide reaction to hearing that someone went to Duke would rage from "that's a good school" to "WOW THAT'S INCREDIBLE!". A Harvard grad probably gets the WOW reaction all the time without fail.

rjkofnovi

"Similarily, a nationwide reaction to hearing that someone went to Duke would rage from "that's a good school" to "WOW THAT'S INCREDIBLE!"."

Wisconsin-Madison? That's a good school. Duke? That's a good school. Harvard? WOW, THAT'S INCREDIBLE!

beyphy

Because sometimes Joe-on-the-Street, is the father of Joe Jr; and he isn't paying for JJ go to some LAC he's "never heard of." Reputation does, at least, have indirect implications for some students.


Wisconsin probably gets a simalar "WOW" in its home region, or somewhere nearby. UCLA, at least, certainly gets both

xiggi

Wouldn't locals know that half the applicants, and probably every competitive student get in at Wisconsin.

Seriously, the stuff some like to say about Duke is simply nuts. There is a world of difference between schools such as Wisconsin and those other silly-named public Ivies and highly selective schools that have a national appeal, starting with the enrolled student body.

sally305

"Wisconsin probably gets a simalar "WOW" in its home region, or somewhere nearby. UCLA, at least, certainly gets both."
--
Sorry, but here in Wisconsin a lot of us only know UCLA as a huge urban school of no particular repute (which is not to say it's not a good school). We hear "Berkeley" and our ears perk up, but UCLA does not have the same reputation as Michigan or even UW-Madison among public universities.

sally305

"Wouldn't locals know that half the applicants, and probably every competitive student get in at Wisconsin."
--
No, because plenty of us IN Wisconsin have seen smart kids get rejected or deferred at UW-Madison. Even kids IN Madison at the city's most competitive high school.

bluebayou

Surprisingly, not xiggi. We have relatives in WI with high schoolers and they are always whining about how difficult Madison is for admissions. I point them to the 70% admit rate (for females), which includes OOS apps, which are supposedly more difficult, but that does not persuade. It's probably due to recent 'competitiveness.' It wasn't to long ago when that 70% was in the nineties. (sorry barrons).

beyphy

With the exception of Berkeley it's mostly regional. A similar phenomenon happens at privates with the exceptions of mostly Harvard, Yale, and Stanford if memory serves.

Michigan's a 'good school' in California. And UCLA's a 'good school' in the east coast. It's not that surprising that it's reputation isn't great in Wisconsin. (whose reputation, unsurprisingly, also isn't great in California.) I mean, how many people from there even go to UCLA? And if you want to bring in arguments about Michigan or Berkeley, the former's much closer; and the latter's the #1 public university.

goldenboy8784

I would be surprised if Berkeley was as well regarded in Wisconsin as Sally thinks. The average layperson thinks the best state school is their own flagship. As for Wisconsin, its not that the school doesn't enroll students from all over the country as Xiggi mentions because it certainly gets a fair share of students from the NY/NJ tristate area, but that the OOSers it enrolls often graduated near the bottom of their class in the good high school and boarding academies of New York. It simply doesn't enroll a strong student body. UCLA's a bit better, but it wouldn't be considered "prestigious" anywhere outside of Southern California.

sally305

"I would be surprised if Berkeley was as well regarded in Wisconsin as Sally thinks."

goldenboy, obviously I cannot speak for all of Wisconsin. I can speak for myself and my friends that I know from our kids' high school. Berkeley has a good reputation but parents I know are starting to become concerned about the same public-university/state-budget issues there (and at other flagships) that are affecting UW.

Also, you should do a little research on the admissions stats for UW vs. UCLA, UCB, etc. Your claim about the OOS students at UW is way off.

Pizzagirl

Yep. One of the most frustrating things about CC is how provincial people are - oh, because my favorite school in my backyard gets accolades in our backyard, people must think that same way everywhere.

xiggi

>>
No, because plenty of us IN Wisconsin have seen smart kids get rejected or deferred at UW-Madison. Even kids IN Madison at the city's most competitive high school.<<

Just shows that the definition of smart kids and the reputation of schools vary around the country. And that the perceived difficulty to be accepted is in the eye of the beholder. And an eye that is blind to the reality.