hawkette

This morning the WSJ published its annual survey of top MBA schools. Here is the link:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1189...we_banner_left

Obviously this is a graduate school ranking so a direct application to undergraduate colleges would be incorrect, but what I found particularly interesting in this story was the comments of various recruiters. Students should consider these thoughts as they compare undergraduate college options and finding an environment that will provide both a great academic experience and graduates that employers actually like and want to hire.

Here are some interesting excerpts:

"Recruiters said interpersonal and communication skills, a teamwork orientation, personal ethics and integrity, analytical and problem-solving abilities, and a strong work ethic matter most to them."

"Some schools received lower ratings because recruiters failed to hire as many M.B.A. graduates as they had hoped and because they said they encountered more "uppity attitudes" from students"

Graduates of the top-rated school were praised for being "well-rounded" students, their personal integrity, interpersonal and communication skills, and teamwork abilities."

One attitude that recruiters encountered and which they greatly disliked was that some "students seemed ultra-relaxed and felt that they didn't need to try to impress the interviewers but rather that the interviewers should try to impress them."

These are all pretty obvious things, but they have ramifications to students as they do a job search. Thus, I encourage students to think about the colleges and the undergraduate experience that they offer and the attitude and the reputation of the college and its graduates among a variety of industries and how this may translate into postgraduate job opportunities.

hawkette

The wording from the WSJ is as follows:

The ranking components for all schools measured includes three elements:

PERCEPTION: The perceptions of the school and its students on 21 attributes (see them at wsj.com/bschools)

SUPPORTIVE BEHAVIOUR: Future plans to recruit at the school and hire its graduates based on two attributes.

MASS APPEAL: For national and regional schools, the number of recruiters indicating that they recruit from the school. For international schools, the number of recruiters that place graduates in jobs outside the US or equally inside or outside the US.

Each of these three components accounts for one-third of a school's overall rank.

bigred07

I wasn't able to access the complete list, but I still found this interesting, so thanks for posting it.

hawkette

bigred07,
I don't know if you noticed this link on the link that I provided earlier. Hopefully, this will allow you to see the full list.

http://online.wsj.com/public/resourc...Scoreboard.pdf

bigred07

Thanks, but. Problem seems to be on the computer I'm using. It's dial up and won't open the page. This is temporary, though. It was striking to me to see that Wharton was not in the top 10 for recruiters, given the worship it receives on CC. For recruiters to say that demeanor and attitude of applicants can matter a lot more than the prestigious degree is pretty interesting.

bluebayou

Umm, perhaps. But, a grad school "philosophy and culture" (for lack of better terms) are bound to trickle down to the undergrad program, if it exists. For example, many of the same faculty teaching the MBA students at Cal-Haas (#2), also teach undergrads. Indeed, some classes are the exact same -- same prof, same TA's, same classroom, etc., the only difference being the course numbering.

But, of course, that brings us full circle to another thread, concerning......

hawkette

bluebayou,
Very good. Chuckle, chuckle, but I'm not going there...or at least I hope not...

UCBChemEGrad

Wow! Harvard MBA at #14... George W. must be P.O.'d with that ranking. LOL

JohnnyK

I think once you're da prez then your college's brand name as gotten you about as far as it's going to go.

That being said, Harvard going to number 14 is probably his fault.

JohnnyK

At the risk of simply proving the arrogance bit, I'd love to see the recruiter that takes a UNC grad before a graduate of Stanford, HBS, or Wharton.

Even if they hate 'em, they are still scrambling to hire them. The Wall Street Journal may give them a chance to vent about it, but their bosses up in HR sure won't care to ask why they didn't grab as many Stanford grads as possible...

UCBChemEGrad

^ Very interesting in the variability of top schools from 2006 to 2007. Michigan from 1 to 7?! MIT from 10 to 4? Northwestern from 6 to 12?

I wonder why Stanford ranks so low?

gellino

Stanford usually ranks low in the WSJ survey because it is all based on recruiters' opinions and recruiters historically have a hard time having Stanford grads accept their offers.

UCBChemEGrad

Stanford: "elitist attitude"
Berkeley: "competence without attitude"

LOL... How can you have an inflated ego being a tree?

UCBChemEGrad

^ Thanks. It was a rhetorical question...

calicartel

This is PRECISELY the reason why the WSJ rankings of b-schools is widely viewed as inaccurate, compared to the more "objective" rankings of USNWR and BusinessWeek.
Supporters of WSJ will claim that it uses the evaluations of those who REALLY matter -- the recruiters -- but it is well known that what's being reported is actually a recruiter *satisfaction* survey rather than a rating of student quality.
Yes, graduates of the absolute top tier schools are generally selective in the types of industries and companies they want to work for. And why not? It's not an unreasonable expectation given the self-selection process that occurs when applicants are applying to b-schools.
So when a recruiter for slightly-less-desirable-corporation gets snubbed by the students of higher ranked school A for jobs that students of lower ranked school B normally jump through hoops for, the recruiters' natural reaction would be that graduates of the former institution are snooty and pompous -- and this is what is manifesting in the WSJ rankings.
Compare the graduate placements of UNC, Ross, and CMU against the likes of Chicago GSB, Wharton, HBS, Stanford, and Kellogg, and you'll see how the "real" hiearchy shakes out.