wwsnyc

I'm a GS graduate. My experience with GS, and I believe that admissions standards have tightened, is that the school has tended to take chances on students. For example, RW Apple Jr, a graduate, originally attended Princeton but didn't do so well and returned to school at GS (so the new admissions standards, if true, would exclude him). It has many graduates like that. Also, when CC was less willing to admit Jewish students, or at least not too many (e.g. Isaac Asimov, a graduate of GS/university extension, was understandably upset with Columbia about this and the College went back and granted him an honorary degree). During that part of the 20th Century, many Jewish students went to university extension (particularly if you had a Brooklyn accent) the administrative precursor to GS' formal organization (GS really took off after the G.I. Bill).

The school graduated 2 nobel laureates, which isn't too bad for such a small school, over the course of the last century. You can see a list of notable alumni, if one is so inclined at wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Columbi...eneral_Studies

I'm proud of my education, and have many CC friends. I must submit, though, that it is accurate that the school is not as prestigious in the minds of many as CC. This doesn't mean the education itself is not excellent. It also has its share of people that are not prepared for columbia. I didn't count to see if there were more or less than in the College. It seems to me, though, that some CC students were willing to overlook less prepared atheletes or legacy students than a GS student who might be a bit more colorful and ask too many questions in class (by virtue of not really caring so much what an 18 year thinks of them).

I do think it ironic though, that transfer students from Harvard, Princeton, or Yale find themselves having to justify their academic bona fides to a minority element of CC who happen to be insecure.

I read mention of GS alumni doing interesting things, including a management guru. I'm pretty successful in what I do (philanthropy and business) and would be interested in hearing from GS alumns that are making a difference and/or successful: wwsnyc@yahoo.com GS, because of its age and history, doesn't have the best alumni relations or opportunities for networking.

(By the way, I agree SEAS rocks. Smartist kid I ever met was from SEAS during my time at CU).

Best of luck here--remember most people care mostly about what you accomplish after school.

redlinekid2

Good point. It's too bad that the admissions office at Columbia GS is overlooking one thing: Some of the schools' greatest Alumnus were never straight "A" students prior to their enrollment at the school. They seem to think that a 4.0 GPA is superior to a 3.5 GPA, without regards to the level of difficulty of the classes and the grades earned as a result. Not all grades/classes are created equal.

It's so ironic when I asked about the reasons behind their decision to reject my application for admission. They told me that my essays and recommendations were excellent. But my 3.5 GPA wasn't good enough, despite taking a very rigorous academic program that would better prepare me for the challenges that I'll face in the upper division classes.

But I'm over it now. My attention is completing my application for Penn College of General Studies. If they reject me, then my final college choice that I'll apply to is the Harvard Extension School. I've always wanted to attend an Ivy League school because of the shear resources that they have with regards to my academic interests. At least, HES will give me an opportunity to prove myself. Is that too much to ask?

WindowShopping

I don't think you are over it, because you've harped on it about half a dozen times on this board. To be perfectly honest, based on everything you've posted, it sounds like something other than your GPA kept you out of Columbia GS. Who exactly did you speak with in admissions? Did you had a chance to better explain your situation and listen to their reasoning? If you're as passionate about the school as it sounds you are, be sure to let them know that. I wouldn't entirely close the door on GS until you're able to discuss your individual situation with someone high up at the school -- starting with the Dean of Admissions. If you defend your grades and strongly sell yourself to whomever's willing to listen, I still think you'd have a shot at GS.

redlinekid2

I have spoken to a high level admissions officer who was a part of the committee that made the decision to reject my application. And he firmly told me that they want students who have at least a 3.7 to 4.0 GPA. The way in which he explained my circumstances was the fact that they are concentrating their focus on students who would normally attend other top tier colleges to apply to Columbia GS in order to improve it academic profile within the Ivy League, as well as to match the academic standards of Columbia College.

In other words, they want students who were strong in both high school and their previous college. They want to recruit the same batch of top students who are applying from other top tier schools. Those were his words.

It made me very angery to hear that because I contacted the admissions office to find out the latest requirements for admission. I didn't believe that it was a 3.0 GPA anymore, for I felt that the standards are much higher. I asked to speak to an admission officer about my concerns prior to applying to the school. They told me that they would like to see a 3.0 GPA, and that the admissions office will contact me concerning my application. They rudefully told me that I can't arrange to speak to the admissions officer concerning admission to the school. If I have had the chance to speak to a senior admissions officer beforehand, I would not have applied to Columbia GS based on those new standards.

I hope that my answer to your question clears up everything about my contact with the school and the reasons behind my ill feelings towards the admissions office at Columbia GS.

WindowShopping

Whomever you spoke with in admissions is either new and doesn't understand GS, or the mission of the school has changed considerably in the past two years (which I highly doubt, even though they did hire a new Dean of Admissions since I started). Many of the most successful GS students come to the school without high school diplomas. They pass the GED and then the GS entrance exam (along with the SAT/SAT IIs or ACT). I've never heard of these "new admissions standards" that you continually cite. And we already attract students who would otherwise attend top tier schools if they went through the traditional direct-to-college process, or started at a top tier, took time off for whatever the reason, and decided to conclude at GS, and even some that are working on a second degree at GS, having earned the first at a top school.

While your experience tends to leave a sour taste in my mouth, you should be aware that the situation - as it has been explained to you and presented on this board - seems to be outside the scope of the typical GS admissions process. For the sake of finality (and perhaps even your own sanity -- tongue-in-cheek), do yourself a favor and set up an appointment with Curtis Rodgers. If you're in the New York area or can be in the New York area, do it in person. Explain your whole situation, what you were told prior to applying, what you've been told was reason for rejection, and express a continued interest in the school. If you're proactive about this, I think you'll be admitted.

Sweetny007

Redline, I know you are upset but this is what you previously posted as your classes... I wouldn't really consider this a rigorous course load. I am sorry you didn't get in but it looks like you are missing math, science and possibly a foreign language.

Fall 2000

English Composition I (Honors) Grade: A

Intro. to Astronomy Grade: A

Intro. to Religion Grade: A

World History (Honors) Grade: A

>>

Spring 2001

English Composition II (Honors) Grade: B

Intro. to Philosophy (Honors)Grade: B

Honors Seminar Grade: A

Intro. to Sociology(Honors) Grade: A

>>

Spring 2003

College Algebra Grade: B

World Literature Grade: A

Intro. to Psychology Grade: B

Earth Sciences Grade: W

>>

Fall 2004

Muli-Ethnic America Grade: A

The Humanities Grade: A

Literature and Culture Grade: B

Social Environment Grade: A

>>

Spring 2005

World History Grade: A

Social Problems Grade: A

Political Philosophy Grade: B

Intro. to Logic Grade: D

WindowShopping

Yikes. I didn't see that posted earlier. There seem to be a number of red flags with that transcript. For starters, only four courses per term. Was that typical of where you were? Did your school not give out pluses and minuses? Why is there a gap between Spring of 2001 and Spring of 2003? Why did you withdraw from Earth Sciences? How can you explain the grade earned in Logic? I agree with Sweetny that your courseload doesn't sound extremely rigorous, at least based on what you posted, and while you seemed to have a couple of outstanding semesters, the rest (and those other questions raised) are slightly alarming from an admissions point of view.

GS_Banding

I told myself I wasn't going to reply to this thread again. Anywho...

redlinekid, it's a shame you didn't get accepted because you seem to really have a desire to attend CU.

As I said the last time I spoke about this, a D in logic doesn't really yell out 'take me!'. You'll have to take math courses to graduate from GS/CU (you said you want to major in Econ, right?), and if you can't pass intro logic what tells them you're prepared to handle calc or statistics? So maybe your grades were a factor but it probably wasn't the fact that you have a 3.5. It was probably the fact that you failed a class last year. Why didn't you get a W?

Also, why did you take the same course twice? To pad the GPA?

GS is forgiving in it's admissions policy but not that forgiving.

redlinekid2

Here is a clearification of my academic record:

The World History classes is actually parts I and II

The Logic Class that I enrolled in did not have any academic support services available in the form of academic workshops and tutorial services. I had trouble understanding the professors' explaination of the material. Without that the help I needed, I couldn't pass the class.

Don't underestimate my ciriculum. Those were some of the toughest subjects around, and they were required for graduation. I reget not taking trigonometry at that time instead of College Algebra, as I took Trigonometry in H.S. I am taking Trigonometry in the summer semester as an audit class.

The foreign language classes I left out deliberately because I wanted to focus on my writing/critical thinking skills in the English language. Why should I take a foreign language class if I can't learn my own? I'll deal with that subject after I've completed my major and other requirements. It's the last subject that I'll deal with.

As I mentioned before, I am focus on Penn's CGS Program. If I can't get in the program, then I'll apply to the Harvard Extension School. At least, they'll give me a chance to show what I can do, unlike Columbia GS.

As for my academic program, I took the most challenging classes that was available at the time. The most interesting classes I wanted to enroll in, such as History of Science, were not available. There were more technical classes at my former school than liberal arts. And because of the consolidation of the Honors Program into the Honors College, I was barred from enrolling in those classes, even though I was once and Honors student. The new program was exclusive to top performing H.S. graduates only.

I hope that I've answered your questions.

WindowShopping

Columbia GS, Penn CGS, Harvard Extension...

I suppose the next logical question is why you seem to be limiting yourself to the few continuing-ed-lite programs offered through ivy league schools? If it's the name of the undergraduate university you're after, you could always plop down whatever it costs to attend Yale as a Special Student.

columbia2007

Just wondering - why do you necessarily think it would be better to attend an extension school of an Ivy League university than become, say, part of the regular student body elsewhere?

redlinekid2

This will be my last post on the Columbia Forum. I have always wanted to attend an Ivy League College for my undergraduate education. However, personal circumstances prevented that from happening while I was in H.S., not because I fooled around. But because I was in special education classes from the second grade to the tenth grade. Thus, when I left the program, I realized that I was far behind from all of the other students. My writing and comprehensive skills were insufficent for the Honors and AP classes. I struggled throughout H.S., but it made me aware of my strengths and weakness. I graduated H.S. in 1991 and went to work at Wal-Mart for nearly a decade before begining my college studies. The experience prepared me for that.

However, I wasn't confident in my writing skills. So I enrolled in the toughest english/philosophy classes to overcome that. Most of my lower grades are actually "B+". However, my school doesn't give "+ or -". Not even pass/fail grades.

I always ask myself why I didn't dropped out of Intro. to Logic. At the time, I didn't want to have another "W" grade on my record. I really wanted to learn the subject matter because I felt that I could at least apply that knowledge to my other subjects. Unfortunately, the class became the greatest frustration of my life because my teacher didn't explain the material clearly, and my classmates were unwilling to help me out. What I thought was to be the highlight of my academic career become a permanent blackeye whenever some looks at my academic record.

I was asked to retake the class for a better grade. However, my professor is the only instructor who teaches the subject, and he changes the material from semester to semester. The class was the worst experience of my life. I deeply regret not taking Pre-Calculus Algebra/Trigonometry instead of Logic.

I have no desire to attend any other college than the ones I'm applying to. Even if it is a special program. As long as I have access to the university's resources, I am satisfied with that. I want my BA degree at an Ivy League college, one way or another. Once I set a goal for myself, I will never let it go until my goal is accomplished.

If going to the Harvard Extension School or Penn CGS will make my eduction a stigma in the eyes of my future employers or the MBA programs, I am ok with that. I have been in special education programs most of my academic life. So I am use to criticisms I get.

But, I'll see how my application status at both Harvard Extension and Penn CGS turns out.

As a kid, I've always wanted to attend Columbia University. But didn't have the skills in high school to get there. Columbia GS was a very rare opportunity for me to embraced my dream and my passion to ulitilzed the resources the university has to offer. I once thought to myself that if I was accepted to Columbia GS, then everything would have come full circle. However, if I was rejected, then it will be the last painful rejection that I'll receive since I applied to a total of ten different colleges, and was rejected by every single one. Here is the list of schools that I applied to over the past 5 years:

Brown RUE
Brown: Regular Transfer
Cornell: CAS(Twice)
Cornell: Industrial and Labor Relations
Stanford
Yale
Howard University
Rice
Columbia GS

There you have it. Since I was rejected by Columbia GS, I can now move on with my life. Good luck to everyone who are attending Columbia GS. I only wish that I had the opportunity to experience the academic vitality of Columbia University as well.

Denzera

OK, so you had "personal circumstances" that prevented you from doing well in high school. Fine. Although he's not going to say so, WindowShopping had some "personal circumstances" in high school that screwed him around pretty seriously... and he ended up going to a few different colleges, getting A's, and finally deciding that New School University stank and transferring up to GS.

The point is, he didn't sit around making excuses for himself and explaining things away... he decided he was ready, did the best he could, did well, and earned a spot here. So it's your goal to get a BA at an ivy league college. Great. I love goals. But a decade at Wal-Mart, while honorable, isn't quite "earning it". That may sound harsh, but you're sitting here making 1000-word posts trying to convince us that you've been wronged, and it's coming across as really entitled. There's even less of a "formula" for getting into GS than there is for getting into traditional elite undergraduate schools, but nothing you've told us here is making me think you deserve that sense of entitlement and outrage. Sorry.

orangetree

Denzera, redlinekid's post did not convey any drift of entitlement when I read it . In fact, I was excited by his desire for an education, and also to defy the
'deterministic' factors of his life. You write of the decade at Wal-Mart as though it invalidates that talent that he may possess. However, I, on the other hand, am impressed by the sheer force of his perseverance. This man is trying to change his life around, and I think that this is inspiring. I also believe that in the end he will get to his goal. Looking at his situation through the eyes of a high school student, I see a contrast between his determination to change and the hopelessness of many people after a certain age. Everyone only has their own life to live, and within the boundaries of simple humanity (not stealing, killing, hurting etc) they aren't accountable to anyone. There is no 'justice' which says that based on his previous life, he does not deserve a good future. Certainly he has done nothing bad, but rather he is trying to make his life better. And perhaps a Columbia (or other) education would also unleash a talent that society has so far cooped up in him, to the betterment of everyone. This is the model GS story.

Denzera

I disagree. I also question whether a university of chicago prefrosh can really speak with authority on what the "model GS story" is. Regardless, your interpretation is certainly the attitude he is trying to convey. I do admire his apparently sincere desire to go to a good college and get a good education, but the snippy way in which he treated those who were offering feedback makes me think he's looking here for gratification, not advice.