jct30

So I am looking at the Duke website tab "Greek Life." I want to rush a fraternity because I think greek life can provide an important formative experience on a number of levels. However, I am not interested in the "cliche" fraternity. Nor do I think race ought to be the most divisive factor in greek life, after gender. But what the Duke website tab on "Greek Life" leads me to believe is that is may be the case, even at a university as academically prestigious as Duke. If you want to see what I am talking about, see the differences between the Interfraternity Council (the well-off white-guy frats who've been around since who-knows-when) and the National Pan-Hellenc Council (the "historically African-American" fraternities).

Please tell me I'm getting the wrong impression...I really just want a smart-frat that isn't too intellectual to mess around every once-in-a-while, but also one that isn't limited according to an average income, skin color or some other superficial characteristic.

Thoughts?

jct30

Ps sorry about the title, I was thinking something different when I wrote it. How pervasive greek life is isn't really what I'm concerned about.

evil_asian_dictator

It's absolutely not like what you saw on the website, which is probably outdated. In nearly every Interfraternity Council frat, there are many different races represented. There are proportionately more "well-off white" kids in frats because those are the kids most interested in Greek life as supposed to students of other races. It's not like an equal amount of say Asians kids and white kids are rushing and the former are being in denied in much larger numbers.

jct30

That is great to hear. I totally expect there to be proportionally more "well-off white" kids, after all I am sort-of one. Thanks for the response, it really makes a difference.

thethoughtprocess

Fraternities that aren't in the IFC are way, way cooler...

bluestar7

Hey jct-
evilasiandictator is dead on -- if there looks to be a trend that there's more white kids in IFC frats, it's because they make up the majority of the kids rushing and therefore, it makes more sense for them to get the majority of the bids -- proportionally, that is. When it comes down to it, there's only one fraternity I can think of that doesn't have any African American kids, and it's the Jewish IFC frat (and that doesn't mean that black kids don't rush and don't get bids, because I know for a fact they do and have, it's just that they choose to go elsewhere) -- even KA, the "southern" frat (at Duke, but moreso nationally) is becoming more racially diverse. If you're a cool, fun kid, you're not going to get cut across the board for skin color, family's income, or other superficial characteristics.

BlondeBludevil

The truth about race and frats/sororities at duke is that a significant amount of self-segregation definitely exists. i am from the north originally so i definitely see it, and i am a rising senior so i've been around it for three years now. in my sorority, the amount of minorities (i.e. blacks, asians, hispanics) can unfortunately be counted on one hand--less than FIVE, in the whole sorority of 30-person girls per year. And frats really aren't that different. Yes, some may have their "token" black or asian guy, but these organizations really aren't a bastion of diversity.

Like i said before, this definitely isn't to say that minorities are kept OUT of the predominantly-white greek life, but even minorities i knew in high school that were friends with all different races, i now see mingling mainly with their own ethnic groups. Thankfully, the classroom setting and social scene beyond greek life provide an opportunity for the races to mingle a bit more.

Furthermore, the segregation issue seems to be compounded, not helped, by recent administration stats, like the fact that the class of 2012 is 25% asian. in my experience at duke, more minorities do NOT mean more integration between ethnic groups--it just means larger ethnic groups. Maybe this will change within the next few years, but i'm not so sure.

Thoughts from other Dukies?

jen0830

The "Core Four" sororities are Pi Beta Phi, Kappa Alpha Theta, Delta Delta Delta and Kappa Kappa Gamma.

incollege88

If you value having friends from diverse backgrounds you will have no problem making that a reality at Duke. The people I know who gripe about "self-segregation" the most decided to stick to their comfort zone and didn't make an effort to branch out. I had tons of friends of different economic and racial backgrounds from me when I graduated. I also was not in a fraternity, though, so I don't know how much that has to do with it. Go to any other school and spend a day or two and you will realize that Duke is not at all unique in that a significant portion of black students like being in the company of other black students/Asian students like being in the company of other Asians/whites in the company of other whites ("self-segregation" does not only apply to minorities, you know). A simple search for "self-segregation" on any major college student newspaper website will reveal this as well. My advice--check out things for yourself. If the organization you are rushing seems to be on the same wavelength as you, go with it. If not, stop rushing it. If frats don't seem to be your thing (they weren't mine), that's okay too. You can have a great time at Duke as an independent. Most of my good friends were in Greek organizations but I stayed friends with them throughout my 4 years at Duke. My friend group involved independents and people in frats and sororities (including "core fore" sororities haha but I have no idea where that comment above came from). Good luck, and I am sure you will find your place.

PS-if you are going to go the frat route you should check out DTD, they sound like a good match to what you are looking for.

incollege88

Also, you should know that the National vs. Interfraternity council thing is not at all specific to Duke. There are "historically African American" fraternities everywhere, for similar reasons to why there are still HBCUs. I wouldn't necessarily look upon it as a bad thing, though my ideal world wouldn't involve race-based organizations either.

SirGecko

Also, what kind of friends you have at Duke really is highly dependent on who you are. My friends have always been a rather diverse group of people. But then again I am not involved in Greek life so I cannot really say how that might affect your experience. (though it does seem like independents tend to have more diverse friends than greeks, but that is just my observation)