Corbett

This is true, although the acceptability of non-ABET degrees may vary, depending on the program. Some engineering graduate programs do require or prefer ABET degrees; others are more flexible.

bigtrees

Companies are often slightly flexible on requiring ABET accredited degrees. Some employers accept engineering degrees from colleges that have at least a couple of ABET accredited engineering degrees, even if the prospective employee graduated with a non-accredited degree from the college in question. (i.e, they would hire you as an engineer if you have a bioengineering degree from a college that offers an ABET accredited mechanical engineering degree, but wouldn't hire you as an engineer if you graduated from a college that doesn't have any ABET accredited degrees (like DeVry or ITT)).

Corbett

I think the bottom line is like this:

1. An ABET-accredited engineering BS degree will be universally respected and accepted by engineering employers, by engineering grad schools (if you pursue an advanced degree), and by state licensing boards (if you pursue a PE license).

2. A non-ABET engineering BS degree, or a related science or technology degree, may or may not find comparable acceptance. Such a degree may turn out to be acceptable, or it may be acceptable with strings attached, or it may be unacceptable. The outcome will be affected by factors like the reputation of the particular school that issued the degree, the particular field of engineering involved, and the flexibility of the particular employer, grad school, or licensing board. It's very difficult to generalize.

fogfog

This has all been helpful. Perhaps a moderator can sticky this so others can find it. With all of these comments and these thoughts in mind..seems our student needs to consider whether they want to study in an undergrad prog of math for example and then move to an ABET Eng masters...or if a 4 yr ABET accredited curriculum is how he/she wants to start...

bigtrees

FogFog,

As mentioned above, most masters degree programs aren't ABET accredited. Until recently, ABET only accredited either the bachelors or masters program and schools almost always chose to have the bachelors program accreddited.

It's also difficult to enroll in masters engineering program without having a engineering undergraduate. At a minimum, you have to take an extensive list of undergrad class (perhaps as many as 15 or so0.

If a student wants to be an engineer, the way to go is to choose an ABET accredited undergraduate degree.

cyclone10

fogfog, actually Harvard's non-engineering sci programs are very new so I would think they are just in the process of becoming accreditated...otherwise there is some other reason for the delay...so i wouldn't dig into Harvard as an example too much...

Corbett

There are very few ABET-accredited engineering MS programs. It's not like architecture, where the B.Arch. and M.Arch. are well established as alternative routes to a professionally accredited degree. In engineering, the concept of the accredited MS degree is generally a new and unusual one. It exists in theory, but is rare in practice, at least for now.

For example, abet.org indicates that California currently has 21 schools with ABET-accredited programs in civil engineering (the discipline where accreditation is most important). They all have BS-level accreditation only. Nationally, there is only one school that I know of (Univ. of Louisville) with an ABET-accredited MS program in civil engineering.

So if you want an ABET degree, you should try to pursue it as an undergradate. It's theoretically possible to get an ABET MS degree, but the options are extremely limited. Accredited engineering graduate degrees may become common in the future (as they did in architecture), but it's not that way yet.

sakky

Uh, since when does Yale offer a better engineering program than Harvard does? Engineering rankings generally place Harvard above Yale.

Besides, Harvard is hardly a 'running joke' among engineering schools. Last time I checked, they were ranked somewhere in the 20's or 30's. Contrast that with the hundreds and hundreds of other engineering programs in the country. If Harvard engineering is 'a running joke', what does that say about those ranked even lower?

hadsed

Well typically you find Harvard at the top of things.. that's the idea you get when someone mentions Harvard. Perhaps it's the running joke of the other overall top tier schools?

sakky

If that's the standard used, then Yale should be a running joke as well. After all, Harvard engineering is ranked higher than Yale engineering.

Look, if you want to state that Harvard is not as good as MIT or Stanford at engineering, nobody is going to argue with you. But it's quite another thing to call Harvard engineering a 'running joke'. Let's face it. The vast majority of engineering students don't attend an engineering program even as good as Harvard's, but are instead attending low-ranked programs at no-name schools.

Personally, I don't see what's so terrible about Harvard offering engineering, even if it isn't as highly ranked as some of its other programs. That's better than not even offering engineering at all, as is the case at certain other top schools such as Chicago or many of the LAC's. And, like I said, Harvard engineering is better than the vast majority of other engineering programs in the country.

saraleigh117

At my school they have about 4 or 5 ABET engineering technology degrees. In the last 3 or so years they have started to introduce 6 new full engineering programs(ConstructionE, MechE, CivilE, SystemsE, ElectronicE and MechatronicE). Because these programs are new and have no graduates until this year or next, these new programs aren't accredited yet.Given that the school already has many ABET accredited programs, is it likely that these new programs will also become accredited? I've got a big problem with being their guinea pig, and I don't know how common this is.

bigtrees

If they have ABET accredited engineering technology programs, and plan on pursuing ABET accreditation for their engineering programs, it is very likely they will receive it. And once they receive ABET accreditation, it will be applied retroactively to your degree as well.

You can always ask the school this question. They should be prepared to answer it to your satisfaction.

saraleigh117

Well I thought about talking to them I just felt there may be a conflict of interest seeing as how they are trying to attract students and not have them transfer out to another program. But I guess it never hurts to ask.

G.P.Burdell

Or perhaps it's the running joke of the uninformed.

Harvard's relatively low engineering rankings are by choice. If Harvard decided tomorrow to be a Top 10 engineering program, it could easily balloon it's enrollment and faculty and reach the top echelon of engineering in 10 years or less. The fact is, Harvard runs the SEAS with a different vision than other engineering schools which keeps it small and its research interdisciplinary, both of which hurt the rankings.

Yes, it is likely. If they've already gone through ABET-EAC accreditation of other programs, they should have a good idea of what the process entails. In that case, you'd have to assume that they wouldn't go through the accreditation process unless they were ready.

I might have a problem being in the first class of a school that has never been accredited, or in a degree where accreditation is usually necessary to practice (like law, environmental engineering, or civil engineering), but for lower impact degrees (mechanical engineering, chemical engineering, etc.) from a school that is already accredited elsewhere, I wouldn't worry.

GLOBALTRAVELER

As I look through the constant e-mails I receive from recruiters either asking "am I available?" or "do I know someone with this skillset?"....I HIGHLY DOUBT that those recruiters are checking for an ABET degree.