mom2collegekids

A very dear friend of mine has a daughter in this situation. She did go to a state school, not private, but she went OOS and borrowed every bit of what it cost. She had a great 4 years, went abroad , lived on campus and spent the college years as though she and the family could afford them. Now it's time to pay the piper, and it has been ruinous.


See, kids hear about living in dorms, being away from parents, doing what they want to do, studying abroad....it all sounds so wonderful. No wonder kids think loans are the answer. They do "want what they want when they want it." 4 years of excitement goes by fast. 10+ years of strangling debt can crawl by.

redpoint

But then on cc we get into roaring discussions about whether or not it's worth it to go to Georgetown (for example) vs a less expensive, less prestigious school, and half the posters insist one must go to the school with the most prestige, or you might as well die (exaggerating). Is the tide turning?

happymomof1

Oh redpoint, the tide turned about four years ago - at least for the parents! There are almost no long-term parent participants here who would say that X is worth $Y more if debt is involved. That big ugly financial collapse in the summer of 2008 changed a lot of people's tunes.

I expect that many of the young people (and their parents) who are now strangulated with debt got headed down that pathway before the summer of 2008.

juniebug

I know a young woman who just graduated from a private LAC, and between Stafford and private loans, she probably borrowed around $120K. She could have commuted from home, but that didn't appeal to her. Currently, she's looking for work with her psychology bachelor's degree. Her boyfriend is in a similar situation, although he did find a job. I am wondering how long these kids will be happy living at home with mom and dad.

lookingforward

Actually, it took a while for the reality to set in with some CC parents- remember the long, angry threads about how it's all the colleges' fault, the highly paid profs (as if) and all that expensive false advertising to mislead little Johnny? Or how hard it is to live on 250k and pay for college, whle maintaining a lifestyle (neighborhoods, cars, perks) those families had earned? It seems as if it was a long denial period.

momtotwins

I think it is a combination of all these things. A good number of kids really are starting out with no parental contributions and are funding everything with loans.
This is expensive even at in state local schools. I think also unless you really study the financial aid process and understand the loan options it is easy to get carried away by the "need to go to a top school." D's friend was accepted at a top school with no merit money and not one penny of financial aid. D said their college fund would cover about 1 year. Mom said to me about 2 weeks after sending in the acceptance letters that she had just startied looking at loans and the terms were really pretty terrible. A little late to be discovering that now after you just signed up for a $60,000 bill! If it wasn't for my husband, a mortgage banker who often finds himself denying loans to people with unbelievably high college loan debt, we could have been sucked into the frenzy as well. Thankfully we have finished the first year with no loans and plan to continue that way as long as we can.

seaside22

Wow! This thread is enlightening. If I chose to aim for a highly-ranked UC I might become one of those, because I calculated I would need 3 years upon the year I just completed at CC to transfer to an impacted major. That would be 4 years at CC doing science and math prerequisites, so that would use up my Cal Grant and Chapter 35 Veterans Dependent benefits (both limited to 4 years). I'd lose $20,000 in Cal Grant money.

If I went to my local CSU (which I could possibly do at the end of this year if I wanted to+could handle 2 difficult sciences and a 3 unit class/ keep 4.0), I could use the $10,000 per year Cal Grant and 2 years left of Chapter 35 benefits ($956 a month during school year, only during the months of classes of the 2nd half of month, not first half, 12 unit minimum). The program's 5 semesters, so assuming I'm accepted I would have 1 semester w/o full financial aid (but still get Pell Grant).

Looking at this thread, it seems most people recommend going to the local state school and having less debt, then maybe using more time to go to a prestigious school and taking out loans? Mostly for me, I want to go to the UC for their opportunities for clinical hours in their highly-ranked hospitals and the opportunity to network. I could learn a great amount from them + use that knowledge to help people.

Which is it? Nearly $0 in debt from a local state school or $30-50k debt for highly-ranked university education w/ networking opportunities?

kayf

Parent here have long accepted not going into debt. What is now happening is that even parents who can pay, and who value higher education, are saying, will my kid be better off if I spend 200K on college, or if I spend 100K and can give 100K for a down payment for a house for a kid. The truly wealthy will spend whatever they want, but the merely upper class are saying, I need to think about this.

mom2collegekids

Wow! This thread is enlightening. If I chose to aim for a highly-ranked UC I might become one of those, because I calculated I would need 3 years upon the year I just completed at CC to transfer to an impacted major. That would be 4 years at CC doing science and math prerequisites, so that would use up my Cal Grant and Chapter 35 Veterans Dependent benefits (both limited to 4 years). I'd lose $20,000 in Cal Grant money.


Why are you spending so many years at a CC???


If I went to my local CSU (which I could possibly do at the end of this year if I wanted to+could handle 2 difficult sciences and a 3 unit class/ keep 4.0), I could use the $10,000 per year Cal Grant and 2 years left of Chapter 35 benefits ($956 a month during school year, only during the months of classes of the 2nd half of month, not first half, 12 unit minimum). The program's 5 semesters, so assuming I'm accepted I would have 1 semester w/o full financial aid (but still get Pell Grant).


Do that ^^^.

What is your major and intended career? I doubt it's one that requires that you go to a UC and would be wise to take on such debt.

lookingforward

Seaside, it sounds like you've been trying to think this through. That's better than when folks make assumptions about loans and when the ultimate factor is what the kid wants, the 18 y.o. Or, how the kid isn't willing to consider cc for part of the education.

For many, a less expensive option can do the trick. If you need specialized training or programs, it can change things. I don't understand all the ins and outs of Cal funding, but can tell you that 40k debt would likely cost you just under $500/mo to repay (that's from my Direct info.) Would your career possibilities make that doable? Would having the UC hospital experience make a significant difference in your ability to actally find a better-paying job?

For many, the debt doesn't automaticaly equate to better job opps. That's the myth. In some fields, yes; at some particularly rigorous colleges, maybe. Networking can be a matter of luck (meeting the right people, etc,) or it can be that the program at the UC actively helps place grads in jobs. Things to think about. Good luck.

sybbie719

I can see how it is very easy to go in to 6 figure debt as I see it every year. A student can go to an in-state school, the family makes too much money for federal/state grants and not enough money to pay out of pocket at a school that cost between 20-25k a year, so they borrow the money.

I agree with the others that wrote that kids want the "whole college experience" complete with dorms, study abroad, etc.

Right here we have a number of threads where students write they did not get enough money to making the school affordable without loans. We recommend more affordable options and perhaps doing CC for 2 years and transferring to a 4 year school. Students/Parent respond that "the student/the kid has worked too hard to attend CC" and deserve the 4 year/dream school.

sally305

"The truly wealthy will spend whatever they want, but the merely upper class are saying, I need to think about this."

Exactly. But the problem is, in many cases, the "merely upper class" or even "merely comfortable enough" parents aren't having the discussion UP FRONT when the kid is applying to schools. One of my closest friends is now in this situation with her child. The family just assumed he would get in wherever he wanted and be courted with merit aid. he wasn't. He got shut out of his top choices, so they are going to pay almost full tuition at a ridiculously expensive school on the B list simply because it's the "most prestigious" of the remaining options. He had merit offers at a number of reputable schools and also got into our state flagship. But because the parents WERE willing to pay full price for an Ivy or other "elite" school, they don't now feel they can say no to what is by all accounts a very expensive consolation prize that the child is "resigned" to attending.

lookingforward

^^ But, a small twist. When the family makes too much money to qualify for much aid, they are already, theoretically, in a better position to help pay off debt. The families who already scrimp are not in that position. Not arguing, just feeling for the latter.

This summer, I'm working with 3 22-23 yo's who went to cc. They are fabulous, handling high level, early-career resps. It makes me see that, for some kids, it's not the name of the instution or the public perception of prestige. It's what the kid brings to the table.

So just sending Johnny off to some school for the full experience or because he "deserves it," seems off. Self-indulgent and not automatically a wise investment.

Sobering detail: young, brilliant, newly minted Ivy med grad turned down a full-ride at a very good regional state U. Just learned she is 300k in debt.

kelsmom

I am wondering how long these kids will be happy living at home with mom and dad.
*****
Or how long mom and dad will be happy with the kids living at home!

Years ago, when I was a couple years out of school, a friend & I were discussing money. He told me that earning money is like putting up shelves in your house. The more shelves you have, the more you feel compelled to get things to fill them ... and I have found this to be true. I have quite a few friends who earn a lot more than H & I. Some still feel that they don't have enough, and they complain about not getting financial aid. On the other hand, I have a number of friends who earn more, and they saved for college. Their kids were able to go to school debt free, due to the choices their parents made.

It's the TRULY middle class who have it hardest. These are folks whose EFC is just a bit over the Pell threshold. The vast majority of these kids aren't going to get significant merit anywhere, and their parents frankly have never earned enough to be able to support a family and sock away a bunch of money in a college fund. It's even worse when these kids are from areas without a CC in commuting distance. I am not an online education fan, but I guess their only option in terms of affordability is online. But when it comes time for the final 2 years, they have to move away. It's really rough for them, because affordability is a huge issue.

mom2collegekids

Mostly for me, I want to go to the UC for their opportunities for clinical hours in their highly-ranked hospitals and the opportunity to network. I could learn a great amount from them + use that knowledge to help people.


What is your major/career goal?


Sobering detail: young, brilliant, newly minted Ivy med grad turned down a full-ride at a very good regional state U. Just learned she is 300k in debt.


Just shows that a student can be "book smart", but not have the walking around smarts to see how insane that is. The payments must be over $3k per month! What idiot co-signed those loans?