Proposed Changes to FAFSA - Page 2

goaliedad · 06-26-2009, 09:57 AM

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IRS data at the press of a button will never happen. It would be a security nightmare. For example, 45,000 student names and SS# were just hacked from Cornell. Using that data, anyone could create a FAFSA account, hit enter and have full access to 45,000 Ivy League families tax returns: a data miner's dream come true. The Ivy League alumni networks will never let this happen.

I don't think they'd ever put the actual values on an online form from the IRS, but probably just compute and show the EFC (if they decide to even continue doing this from the above posts) and most likely show the Pell and/or other Government aid eligibility figures.

I would imagine though that you might be able to request a printed report to be sent to the address on the 1040 with the actual figures so that you can verify the results.

Lots of ways to manage this process.

bluebayou · 06-26-2009, 11:56 AM

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The middle class gets the shaft once again

Why is this a surprise? Benefits to "the middle class" costs big money. And, since the middle class pays a bunch of taxes, it's extremely inefficient and a waste, IMO, to raise their taxes to just to give them benefits.

btw: I disagree strongly with sue's earlier post (#2). I can see where it would be a huge impediment to the really poor and uneducated parents. I did taxes/fiinance for a living in the dark ages (so I'm knowledgeable about terms and forms), and believe that fafsa ain't easy, even for a simple return (W-2s, married, etc.). Heck, most CPA's I know complete fafsa incorrectly on behalf of their clients. OTOH, I don't know that it can get a whole lot easier IFF assets are to be included. In our school district, many families have zero/little US income, but receive $$ from parental units offshore. They neighbors own a house (bought with parents' gifts) and cars, but yet have zero/little income; thus, the kids (born here) would easily qualify for need-based aid if it was income-only.

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some college officials worry that states and colleges might stop using the FAFSA -- and require students to fill out other forms to apply for state or institutional aid -- if they no longer believe the federal form gives them sufficient information on which to base their decisions.

UVa already does this; they ask for assets and most other items captured by the Profile. Even worse, UVa requires all finaid applicants to rekey all fafsa data into its own finaid system -- you'd think the IT techies at UVA woulda figured out a way to upload the fafsa electronically like every other college. Or, better yet, UVa would just use the Profile as well.

sueinphilly · 06-26-2009, 12:37 PM

^^^ then I must be a genius because it took me maybe 15 minutes to fill out the fafsa after I had my done my taxes. I have 1 w-2 a couple of bank accounts and nothing special. In fact, my tax return software printed a page with numbers to put on the fafsa. it isn't rocket science. It's a form. it's no harder than doing taxes (which took maybe 45 minutes to do both mine and my son's and he had 4 jobs in 2 states)

Nova10 · 06-26-2009, 08:18 PM

I found the FAFSA form to be fairly easy to fill out. The key is to do your taxes first. After that, it is mostly just trying to find the line the FAFSA form is asking form. It never took me more than 30 minutes to fill it out. I did it as both a dependent and independent student. It did not take that much effort for my parents to add their information, and they have a moderately difficult tax return.

standrews · 06-26-2009, 10:57 PM

Consider the questions that come up on this forum regarding FAFSA. The most difficult questions are about deadbeat parents, i.e., parents that can't be found or won't provide the information. For these types of problems it is not a question of FAFSA being overly complicated; it's a problem with irresponsible and uncooperative parents or step parents.

The issue of simplicity vs. fairness is huge here. To be fair in meting out financial aid, schools need accurate information about income and assets. If simplicity results in data that fails to provide a comprehensive summary of a family's financial condition, fairness will suffer. That must be weighed against the unfairness of complexity that creates a barrier to even applying for aid. Personally, I don't think the form is too hard to figure out, but I can imagine that it's a daunting task to many people.

It is the colleges, not the Dept. of Education, that have the final say on simplicity. What I see happening is the development of a two-form system. It already exists at many private colleges as evidenced by the requirement to file FAFSA and Profile. Even schools that only use FAFSA often require a supplemental form to be filled out. A simpler FAFSA will result is pushing the complexity on to a supplemental form.

Estudiante01 · 06-27-2009, 12:42 AM

The FAFSA should take into account siblings who are no longer dependents since many colleges base their aid entirely on the FAFSA. I'm the youngest of five, but I appear to be an "only" child (according to the FAFSA) whose parents were able to save for years instead of spending money on raising five kids.

JustAMomOf4 · 06-28-2009, 08:13 AM

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The only reason they use FAFSA is to determine eligibility for federal aid. The simplification of FAFSA may just end up pushing the complexity down to the state and individual colleges.

The Federal Gov't only uses FAFSA to determine federal grant eligibility. This is the sole purpose and colleges are free to ask for more information.
Why should the Feds ask for a whole bunch of info that is irrelevant to them?
This has nothing to do with fairness to the middle class. Figuring out Pell grant eligibility is pretty simple and the middle class isn't eligible.
I think the FAFSA EFC should just be replaced with a simple YES (Pell eligible) or NO ( Pell not eligible). This will eliminate a lot of false hope and misunderstandings.

More individual colleges that are fafsa only schools now will develop their own forms or ask for profile information.

usdenick · 06-28-2009, 11:14 AM

While it would certainly be annoying for students to have to fill out more than one form, don't forget that there are MANY schools that don't give any aid besides federal aid. I attended two community colleges and neither gave any aid besides the federal aid. In these cases, students would not need to fill out a separate form to receive school aid.

I think for some of my classmates at community college a radically simplified FAFSA would have encouraged them to file for aid. I did know a few classmates who simply didn't do the FAFSA because it looked "too hard." These are 1st gen college students who are 17, 18, 19 and are managing financial aid all on their own. The whole process of having to gather tax forms and bring them into the financial aid office can be a huge burden, especially when your parents didn't go to college and don't really understand the importance of what you are trying to do.

bluebayou · 06-28-2009, 11:52 AM

fafsa is also used to determine subsidized stafford eligibility...

kelsmom · 06-28-2009, 12:34 PM

Bluebayou, you are correct - and this is exactly the thing I have a problem with. The plan to do away with subsidies for loans does take away one of the only helpful aid programs for the middle class (and I am not talking about the upper middle class/lower upper class - I am talking about those who make too much for Pell but not enough to cover COA even by federal EFC formula standards). That & work study are the only things that are available from the feds to at least take a bit of the sting out of financing college.

h00dr1chh · 06-28-2009, 08:13 PM

I wish FAFSA would change the fact that if your parents are divorced, BOTH parents' income affects how much aid you are eligible for. Because, for example, I live with my mother and my father does not give us jack ****, yet his income is still considered when in reality, I won't be receiving any money from him.
Though I really don't know how they could fix that.

'rentof2 · 06-28-2009, 10:24 PM

h00dr1chh, FAFSA won't need any information about your father if your parents are divorced and you live with your mother. The CSS Profile form will ask about your father's income and assets, but that form is used at the discretion of (mostly) private colleges that give away their own money. FAFSA, however, does not ask, and will not ask.

BPKO43 · 07-09-2009, 04:01 PM

It's commonly agreed that filing the FAFSA is a pain in the @$$. Especially for those who have rather complicated tax returns (itemized deductions, etc.) There are a million different exceptions and "do this if/subtract that if....." that make it a huge headache for lots of people. Not to mention all the hassle of the pin and the fact that their website/support is pretty poor. Plus, many colleges ask you for the forms by the end of February, so in order to get that done you have to work on your taxes 2 months earlier, a huuge task in and of itself. It's a complicated task for all kinds of families of all means, unless you're rich enough to not care about/expect any aid from the school.

robb817 · 07-14-2009, 02:53 PM

sueinphilly - its not that easy for everyone. my dad owns his own business and my mom is an indpendant contractor. neither of them have recieved a pay stub for 20 years or more.

robb817 · 07-14-2009, 02:58 PM

I surely agree that the fafsa is long, complicated, drawn out, and a pain in the ass. But what isn't when your dealing with the government? People will find a way to get it filled out if they want free money, no doubt in my mind about that... maybe they make it hard because they know that a certain percentage of people will just say screw it and not fill it out. if everyone did, they wouldnt have enough money. just a thought..