Difficulty

enfall2004 · 10-24-2009, 10:21 PM

My child is just about to apply ED to Grinnell, which is something of a reach, but she loved it on a visit. I am starting to get cold feet for her because of some descriptions of Grinnell that suggest it is a school for workaholics. How true is that? Do students study all weekend? How intense are the literature classes?

My child is highly intellectual and loves to learn and to think but also has a lot of interests other than schoolwork. (Her devotion to these interests resulted in accomplishments in ECs, a well-rounded time in high school with a very strong but not outstanding GPA, which is what makes Grinnell a reach.) She liked Grinnell better than some of the east coast LACs because many of the LACs had an "intense, overworked anxious" feel while Grinnell seemed more laid back. Is her impression right?

WanderingTree · 10-24-2009, 11:32 PM

Well, I think your daughter is right in the sense that there isn't a competitive atmosphere at Grinnell compared to schools like Bard or Amherst. Students are left to their own devices which for the most part just happens to be working extremely hard, wanting to learn everything and setting many goals. I remember short courses where visiting professors didn't want to give the students a whole lot of work. Guess what happened? The students ASKED the professor to PLEASE give them more work.

By and large, I spent about 8-10 hours on papers, research projects and homework outside of class on any given day (obviously during mid-terms and finals life can be crazy though). On the plus side, these long hours foster community. I met some of my best friends from study groups and during those long hauls in the library or lab. During one project of mine, I had to get up a 4am for almost a month and drive out to the environmental research area with my professor and my lab partner. Sometimes we made cookies or bread for the ride - yay! Maybe I'm just a masochist, but I found a strange beauty in watching the sunrise with my fellow all-nighters after a hours and hours pouring over books.

The thing is, Grinnellians don't know anything else so they think it's normal until they talk to their friends at other colleges and realize the difference. By then, Grinnellians have already gotten used to it. It's not all work and no play though and students definitely don't study ALL weekend. I think most students are able to find a balance between school work, socializing and extracurricular activities. For students that are having trouble managing their time, the college also has resources to help in that regard. Think of this way - your daughter will be more prepared for graduate school should she choose to go that route than many other people.

M's Mom · 10-25-2009, 09:02 AM

It's absolutely not a school for workaholics-all the kids are very engaged in their ECs. They are what makes the campus so lively and interesting. But I do think your daughter's experience of the place will depend a lot on how rigorous her high school experience was. S attended a rigorous public school and was accustomed to working hard-several hours of homework each night and every weekend. But he also had time for his sports, music and his other ECs. It just meant he had to be organized and plan ahead.

Grinnell? Same story. Friends from similarly rigorous high schools confirm this. However, those from schools where they were used to being top students without a lot of effort found the first semester tough going until they adjusted their expectations.

Youdon'tsay · 10-25-2009, 11:28 AM

Did I read the correctly? Eight10 hours a day outside of class?

WanderingTree · 10-25-2009, 12:46 PM

8-10 hrs isn't so bad actually. It's not like H.S. where students begin their work after school and their extracurriculars. Students have a lot of time during the day to get started. Like the other poster said, if a student manages their time wisely, there is still lots of time for extracurriculars and socializing.

_Silence · 10-25-2009, 05:01 PM

I would say Grinnell is a place for busy students. With busy I mean studying or anything course-work related but also ECs. Even though some classes can get pretty hard, most students here are still involved in a ton of ECs.
If Grinnell teaches you one thing early on it's definitely time management. Otherwise you don't get through the work and your Ecs.

enfall2004 · 10-26-2009, 08:28 AM

Thanks so much to all. Sounds like Grinnell probably is a good place for my daughter. I do have another related question: Do first-year students students who work hard earn B's or better?

I went to a LAC where I almost failed out first semester but did fine after that. At our 25th reunion, people "came out" about that; it seems as though most of the people I knew had similar experiences but at the time were too traumatized to mention their grades. The low grades weren't caused by difficulty adjusting to college workloads in most cases; looking back, I think the professors were more likely to give low grades to first year students to demonstrate the seriousness of a college education or the fact that just because we did well in high school we would in college. Interestingly, most of my fellow alums and I thought we produced work of similar quality to the work freshman year but earned very good grades for it later on. I wish I had known that this type of grading was in place first year because I would not have felt so awful back then.

WanderingTree · 10-26-2009, 07:17 PM

On grades: it depends on the class and the professor. Some professors don't believe in punishing students with grades while others rarely give out As (and a B is a sign of incredibly hard work). Many introductory classes are notorious for being some of the hardest in their departments. In any case, I think incoming students should realize that they cannot expect the same results that they received in high school (for the most part). Grinnell is hard. The classes and the professors are challenging. A mixture of As and Bs (maybe the occasional C for a really hard ass prof/course) is achievable. Straight As? Also possible but less common. A 4.0 cumulative GPA? I read somewhere that it only happens once or twice in a decade. By and large, if you show professors that you are putting in effort and are contributing to discussions, you'll get what you deserve.

bethievt · 10-29-2009, 04:40 PM

My son, I am sure, does not put in anything like 8-10 hours per day on coursework and he's been on the Dean's list 2 out of 4 semesters, but he's not taking any math or science courses which I understand are more time consuming. He was also able to do lots of ECs in HS and keep his GPA up, so Grinnell wasn't really a reach for him, though it turned out to be his dream school. The thing is, I don't think they will accept your D if they think she can't do the work and there are tons of support services there. The students love to learn and they don't compete with each other. As Wandering Tree says, there will be the occasional prof who doesn't believe in giving As. Might as well learn to deal with that.