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if my birth country forbids dual-enrollment, can I become a US citizen in secret?

galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
edited May 2008 in International Students
"In secret" from my birth country's government of course. I mean, if I apply to become a US citizen (I have been a PR of the US since 12/09/97), how would my birth country's government find out?

I want to keep my birth country citizenship because eventually I intend to return there to campaign for political reform and maybe run for public office (haha, suicide!). I suppose my holding of US citizenship in secret is not something I would want to come out in the mudslinging should I ever want to seek a political career in my birth country, so is there any way, that once naturalised, to "convert back" to being a PR?
Post edited by galoisien on
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Replies to: if my birth country forbids dual-enrollment, can I become a US citizen in secret?

  • galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
    Oops, can a mod correct this to "dual citizenship" please ... was too preoccupied with attaching my dual-enrollment transcript to my scholarship applications lol.
  • BegonerBegoner Posts: 330Registered User Member
    I might be missing something here, but if your country does not permit dual citizenship, then wouldn't becoming a US citizen preclude you from being a citizen of your birth country? In that case, you couldn't do so without the government of your birth country noticing (or at least logically inferring that you became a citizen of a foreign nation).
  • galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
    then wouldn't becoming a US citizen preclude you from being a citizen of your birth country?

    Yes, exactly. I might lose my birth country citizenship.

    BUT I'm tired of being treated like a second-class citizen in the States (OK, I'm not a citizen at all). On the other hand, I do want to pursue a political reform campaign in my birth country.

    How would my birth country notice?
  • BegonerBegoner Posts: 330Registered User Member
    At a minimum, they would know that you no longer were a citizen of their country. From this, they could infer that you applied for citizenship to another country (although they would not necessarily know which one). However, in all likelihood, there would be some sort of mandatory communication between the US government, you, and your birth country's government regarding your citizenship status. Becoming a citizen of a different nation is no small undertaking -- I'd be very surprised if the business could be conducted in secret. Also, does becoming as US citizen as opposed to being a permanent resident really entail such a large marginal cost in terms of your aims?
  • galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
    At a minimum, they would know that you no longer were a citizen of their country. From this, they could infer that you applied for citizenship to another country (although they would not necessarily know which one).

    Wouldn't they infer this the other way round....?

    What I want to do is naturalise, get my documentation, and show my US passport when I go to US airports, and show my birth country passport when I go to my birth country.
    Becoming a citizen of a different nation is no small undertaking

    I consider myself a citizen of both nations in spirit. I have lived half my life in one nation and half in the other. I have moved back and forth several times.
    Also, does becoming as US citizen as opposed to being a permanent resident really entail such a large marginal cost in terms of your aims?

    I'd like to be able to vote, run for state, county or local office sometime in my life, maybe be eligible to hold a federal position, maybe become an officer if I decide to join the military. The things only a citizen can do (as opposed to a PR) are tremendous.

    I had a very close shave with the financial aid and admissions process this year due to my expired green card that I had difficulty renewing due to my family's low-income background (and the paperwork was a pain to fill out).

    Because I said on my PSATs that I wasn't intending to apply for US citizenship as soon as possible, I was disqualified from being being a National Merit Semifinalist.

    Oh, it's embarrassing when you pass by the table in school that are recruiting people to register to vote and you have to decline because of your immigration status.

    "Who are you going to vote for this year? Obama, McCain or Hillary?"
    "Actually ... I can't vote cuz I'm not a citizen."
    "Oh."
    "If it's any comfort, I would have voted Libertarian."
  • galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
    Also, it would be pretty nice to have the experience of voting at least once in my lifetime. My birth country's elections are a joke.
  • BegonerBegoner Posts: 330Registered User Member
    If you become an American citizen, wouldn't your birth country passport become invalid? Also, I meant that it was no small legal undertaking insofar as it most likely can't be done without all the parties involved being cognizant of the what has occurred. However, I know very little about immigration law -- it may indeed be possible to do what you're asking.
  • pearlygatepearlygate Posts: 581Registered User Member
    BUT I'm tired of being treated like a second-class citizen in the States (OK, I'm not a citizen at all). On the other hand, I do want to pursue a political reform campaign in my birth country.

    Just want to point out this... I think this is how the society will regard your new citizenship.

    Even after you are naturalized you're still a second class citizen. You can't be the president of the USA ever (even if you're capable and have reside in the US for more than 14 years). The term "naturalized" citizen or "immigrant" will stick to your profile for your entire life. You will never be the same as the "native" or "natural born" American. You'd still have problem answering the question "where are you from?" or "were you born here?". The word "born here" is actually used quite a lot, even in the media. Like in describing someone, people usually say something like this: Mr X was born in blah blah, so your "born identity" is something that will stick to you forever. Then from reading your description people could infer... oh he's just some immigrant here... or oh he didn't grow up in the US.. He's not a part of us... He's not american... So people can stigmatize you a little bit especially in politics... Whereas some foreigner who're born in the US just "accidentally" can be considered a "native"... Wish people would stop doing this though.
  • ragingmenragingmen Posts: 87Registered User Junior Member
    I don't think you can just flash your passports around depending on when you needed which.

    When you enter your home country (atleast for me), they need to know where are you coming from, why did you go there, how long did you stay etc etc. if you were a citizen. Also, they also check to see you whether or not you had appropriate authorization to enter that country in the first place. The same also applies when you are entering the US.
  • happymomof1happymomof1 Posts: 19,555Registered User Senior Member
    This is a question for an immigration lawyer familiar with the laws and systems of your home country. Each set of country-country relations is unique.

    Generally speaking, if you naturalize in a country that doesn't recognize dual citizenship, and your old country doesn't recognize dual citizenship, you will now be a citizen only of the new country. In some cases the new country goes to far as to invalidate your old country's passport and mail it back to your old country's embassy so they are sure to take you off the list.

    Generally speaking, the US does NOT recognize multiple nationalities. There are specific cases when it more or less tolerates/turns a blind eye, but you had best check out the specifics of your own situation to find out if you would qualify.
  • Pistolen08Pistolen08 Posts: 684- Member
    what is your birth country?
  • galoisiengaloisien Posts: 3,741- Senior Member
    Even after you are naturalized you're still a second class citizen. You can't be the president of the USA ever (even if you're capable and have reside in the US for more than 14 years).

    That's OK, I'm not *that* ambitious. I just want to campaign for educational reform in my home state (Maine), after seeing the poor way in which it treats struggling kids and immigrant students.

    Besides, I've faced stigmatised as an "Americanised" individual in my birth country too -- other schoolchildren would make fun of my accent. But I really don't care if I get labelled a "naturalised" citizen, I would still be a citizen, and would be legally entitled to all the rights of such, and won't have to repeat this nightmare of renewal ever again.
  • b@r!umb@r!um Posts: 9,519Registered User Senior Member
    I thought the US does recognize multiple nationalities but I might be wrong. A quick google search on .gov sites came up with the following two hits. But I agree that this is definitely something to consult an immigration lawyer about, not a few strangers on the web.
    (a) Dual Citizenship . The concept of dual citizenship means that a person is a citizen of two countries at the same time. Dual nationality laws and policies depend on each country. The U.S. Government recognizes that dual citizenship exists, but does not endorse it as a matter of policy because of the problems that it may cause. Dual citizens owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there. There may be a conflict with the U.S. laws, which may cause problems for the dual citizen. Additionally, dual citizenship may limit the United States Government’s efforts to assist United States citizens abroad.
    ProPublish Reference
    Successful applicants must swear an oath of allegiance promising to give up his allegiance to other countries. The applicant must swear to "renounce and abjure absolutely and entirely all allegiance and fidelity to any foreign prince, potentate, state or sovereignty. . . ." He also must renounce any hereditary titles or positions of nobility.

    However, the INS does not require applicants to take steps to renounce their foreign citizenship when they become U.S. citizens, e.g., they do not have to file a renunciation of citizenship at the consulate of their native country. According to State Department officials cited in a November 15, 1999 Washington Times article, the oath is not enforced and is likely unenforceable. The article quotes a department spokesman as saying that: "The U.S. allows dual nationality. It doesn't keep track of persons who are something else besides a U.S. citizen. And there is no such thing as being less than a full U.S. citizen with all the rights. We have no interest in a person's dual nationality or whether he votes in a foreign election -- that's not an expatriating act."

    The State Department's current formal position is that the U.S. government recognizes that duel citizenship exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. For example, claims of the other country on the individual may conflict with U.S. law, and dual citizenship may limit the U.S. government's ability to assist the citizen abroad.
    Dual Citizenship
  • BegonerBegoner Posts: 330Registered User Member
    Incidentally, if you want people to believe that you're "American" (in the nativist, not legal, sense of the term), you should spell words such as Americanized, naturalized, and stigmatized with a "z." :)
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