joinville

Justin,
First, I want to start off by thanking you for your time and well thought out responses. Your replies have been very educational, particularly as they relate to the admissions process. While my son is already accepted ED at Lafayette, in two short years I'll be starting this process again with my daughter.

Next are my questions: Are students who have been accepted ED considered for Marquis and Trustee scholarships? If they are, are they judged equally with the accepted RD candidates? From what I can tell by the posts here, the scholarships seem to be used as a tool to encourage top RD candidates to enroll at Lafayette.

I thank you in advance for your response and perhaps we'll get a chance to meet you at the April 23rd Experience Lafyette Day.

candyman92486

Hello joinville,

Congrats to your son for being admitted ED! You must be so proud of him (and relieved that the process is over, if only for a short time).

These are some really great questions that required me to stop by the admissions office earlier this morning. As you might already have found out from previous posts, I was given a Marquis Scholarship after applying RD. I know many other Marquis/Trustee Scholars, and off the top of my head, I honestly do not think ANY of them applied ED.

Interesting, huh?

Well, after doing a bit of snooping, I found the exact statistics for these scholarships over the past few admission cycles. It turns out that the merit scholarships are given out in a MUCH higher percentage in the RD round (I really don't think I should be sharing any specific percentages, though). I have taken into consideration the fact that the ED group is much smaller, and took the time to calculate actual figures for both rounds of applicants in terms of scholarships per student. In this way, the size of each round is negated (obviously the RD round is larger and should receive more scholarships, but proportionally, RD applicants get the bulk of the scholarships).

Why might this be so? Why are ED applicants given the short end of the stick?

If an applicant is admitted ED, they are BOUND to accept Lafayette's offer of admission. Even if they don't receive a dime in merit/need-based aid, they really have no choice...we got them to commit. Why would any college use up their limited number of scholarships on those applicants not in need of persuasion? Sadly, as I found out today, this is common practice at almost all ED/RD colleges.

The merit-based scholarships are meant to entice top applicants to come to Lafayette. These types of students usually get many great offers from many great schools, but we hope that $8,000/year or even $16,000/year might be just enough to turn the tides in Lafayette's favor.

Also, the school is always hesitant to give out many of the scholarships ED because they never know how the overall quality of the RD applicant pool will be. Maybe many RD applicants will be stellar students, or maybe it will be a "slow year". Admissions needs to keep the bulk of the scholarships on hand just in case many applicants from the RD pool prove to be exceptional students (at least on paper!).

Although this practice may not seem fair, since when has the admissions process claimed to be fair? Just asking...

I hope that answers your question. Maybe we'll be seeing each other on April 23, as I will most likely be leading tours that day.

All the best,

J

Scrowman

How helpful is it at Lafayette if a parent graduated from the college?

candyman92486

Hey Scrowman,

I am surprised it took as long as it did for someone to ask the infamous "legacy admission question"! You win the prize for being the first...don't you feel special?

The power of being a legacy applicant can't be denied. Here at Lafayette, legacies get a MAJOR boost in the admissions process because of the support the college receives from its alumni network (alumni help with off-campus interviews, offer internship opportunities for students, donate big bucks, etc.)

The increase in a particular applicant's chances of admission depends on the extent to which their parent (a Lafayette alumnus) is still involved with the college. Obviously, if the alumnus donates like crazy and has buildings named after him/her, chances for admission are 99.9% for that legacy applicant.

If an applicant's parent is involved in a smaller way (helping to organize alumni affairs, for instance), the chances are given a decent boost. This boost could definitely spell admission for a legacy applicant who otherwise would not have been considered, let alone admitted.

As for legacies with parents who choose not to maintain ties to Lafayette, chances still are given a boost, albeit a slightly smaller one. However, it could easily mean the difference between "ADMIT" and "REJECT".

Does all this really seem fair? Of course not! Applicants should not be admitted due to the qualifications or connections of their parents, but sadly, the practice of admitting legacies happens at every college and university. Here at Lafayette, being a legacy means A TON, more so than at most colleges simply because of Lafayette's obligation to "pay back" those alumni who are still involved in one way or another by admitting their children.

As you can probably tell from my post, I was NOT a legacy at any of the colleges/universities I applied to. Even legacies recognize how unfair the whole practice is to other, more qualified, applicants.

Allow me to illustrate a situation which happens all the time in admissions here at Lafayette (and other colleges across the nation). Two applicants are vying for a single spot in Lafayette's incoming Class of 2010. Applicant A is male, white, has a combined SAT of 1420, GPA of 3.82, and rank of 32/274. Applicant B is also male, white, has a combined SAT score of 1230, GPA of 3.21, and rank of 153/274. Both applicants go to the same high school, and their family incomes are equivalent. They are involved in many of the same extracurriculars, both are involved in a varsity sport, and both volunteer regularly in their community.

Who do you think will be admitted?

That doesn't seem that difficult, now does it? Well, what I forgot to tell you is that Applicant B's parents both went to Lafayette. Neither parent, however, maintains ties to Lafayette. Applicant A's parents are both graduates of very prestigious schools, but neither attended Lafayette.

Do you see where I am going with this one?

Applicant B would be admitted over Applicant A, even though Applicant A is obviously more qualified and would most likely perform better academically during their four years here at Lafayette.

Damn, when are they going to figure out how to fix this whole process so that "stuff" like this doesn't happen? I don't know about you, but it honestly makes me sick just thinking about the prospect of a less qualified and less deserving applicant being admitted over a harder working, more determined applicant.

There's my rant...hope you enjoyed it!

J

Scrowman

I am an alum- my son has applied regular admission but has lately started to lean toward the college. This was a surprise to me- I did not push him toward the school but took him to visit when we were "on tour". He is in top 10% of his HS class, takes all honors and AP courses- SAT-720 Math, 590 verbal, 650 writing, 29 on ACT- tennis team and a very good bass guitarist. I would think he would get into Lafayette on merit but I also would think my being a grad would tip the scale so to speak. I have contributed to the school minimally over the years and was an alumni interviewer many years ago until I got disgusted with the process. Anyway- you seem to have a pulse on the admission process and I'd appreciate your thoughts. BTW- his first choice was Vanderbilt but he's having second thoughts (distance from girlfriend I believe).

candyman92486

Scrowman,

I actually had a feeling while writing my post that you were asking about legacies because it pertained to you specifically...it turns out I was correct!

I hope you did not take offense to my post, as I let my disgust for legacy admittance get the best of me. I did not intend to insinuate, in any way, that all (or even some) legacy applicants are "stealing" spots away from more qualified applicants. There are many legacies, such as your son, who really do not need that "extra push" to get in. He would have had a great chance of admission based on his own merits, for sure.

It sounds as if your son is beginning to lean toward Lafayette for his undergraduate education. Good for him! I really respect you for not pressuring him into attending Lafayette...you are doing the right thing by letting him "feel it out" for himself.

Vanderbilt is a great school as well...what is your son thinking of majoring in? If he is undecided, what are his interests?

If you do not mind me asking, what exactly "disgusted" you about the interview process? I was thinking of becoming an alumni interviewer after graduating from Lafayette, so I am eager to hear about your experience.

Thanks!

J

Scrowman

No offense taken- I tend to agree with you actually.
Well my son applied to Vandy ED so if he gets in- he's going. I guess that's a whole new thread-what happens when you change your mind after getting in ED to a school. Anyway- my son is undecided on a major although he leans to math and science- maybe engineering but he has a music interest as well. (Hence Vandy as a good opportunity).
My experience with the Alumni interview process was negative because I felt that the staff didn't care about my input- I felt they thought I was just there to sell the school and make their job easier. I expected them to think more about what I thought as to whether the applicant was a "good fit" apart from the usual stats. Maybe their idea was that I was to be an ambassador but I was busy too and after a while, I believed it was a waste of MY time. One person in particular REALLY wanted to go to Lafayette, I made calls for him etc. and he was rejected- that was the last straw (he went to Holy Cross)
BTW- Lafayette is a far different place than when I was there. The facilities are fantastic- especially the sports center and the student center. And the dorms are palaces compared to what I remember. I was in South College as a freshman and it's nite and day. And of course- it was all male in the 60's! Ha!

danashu

Justin let me begin by thanking you for the well considered replies you have been providing to the posters. You seem very warm and caring. I am Dana's Dad and I have a question that only an ole jaded attorney would ask. How can a young man with only four months at a college know as much as you purport to know about the inner workings of the admin process? How do you have access to the confidential statistics you have been citing? What is your job in the admin office? Do you believe that the Dean of Admissions would feel comfortable with the information you have been providing to the propective students? Your opinions voiced based upon your brief experiences are of course subjectively valid for you but is your information based upon objective evidence that you are allowed to be privy to as a first semester Freshman?

Please understand that I admire your desire to help and the truly warm expressions to all of the posters and for that I thank you. I just want to understand your bona fides to render your statistical opinions versus your opinions on dorm room size etc. I hope you do not read any meanspirited motives in this posting. It's almost like you are a member of the admissions inner sanctum. Dana's Dad

candyman92486

Dana's Dad,

I completely understand how you might be skeptical as to my credentials. I am, as you know, a first-year student. You are correct when you state that I have only been at Lafayette for about four months, so your concern over the validity of my responses is well-taken.

Let me start out by saying that I am glad you are taking such a fatherly role on these message boards. After all, you never know what your daughter may be reading and/or believing. There is A LOT of incorrect information on this website, and as a member of an internet community, one must be able to differentiate the facts from the lies and exaggerations found on such a site.

I took a great interest to the college admissions process from the moment I began looking at colleges in my sophomore year of high school. I read anything and everything relating to the process, and was always eager to learn more. By the time I had decided on Lafayette, I must have read thousands of pages on how to write college essays, how to take the SATs, how to fill out each part of the application, how to put together an appropriate resume, how to conduct oneself during an interview, etc. Even after reading all I could find on the subject, I still felt the desire to learn more.

As a tour guide, I was required to study all aspects of Lafayette College before I could lead prospective students around campus. I know WAY too much about Lafayette, and love to share my "wealth of knowledge" during tours. I was determined to start giving tours ASAP, and within a month after arriving on campus, I had reached my goal.

As part of being a "tour guide", I find myself spending too much time in Markle Hall, home of the Office of Admissions. When I am not giving tours, I am answering phone calls, working the front desk, entering applicant data, or organizing/opening/filing the mail as it arrives to make the jobs of the admissions officers a bit easier.

I am amazed, as you are, at the amount of information I learned about the admissions process within a few short months. You must understand that, when I am not in class or doing homework, I spend the majority of my free time in the admissions office. I have always been a very curious and observant person, so naturally, I caught on quickly. The employees are always willing to answer my questions about how the process works, and they seem to have no problem sharing what they know (even if that means helping me look up specific percentages).

Any and all information that I have divulged on these boards is "fair game". I have NOT given out any pieces of confidential information. Nothing I have said up to this point would be cause for concern...I know this as a fact because everyone in the office is aware of what I do on this website. They are very pleased that I have taken on the added responsibility of answering prospective student questions on this board. They were actually considering hiring a person to do what I am doing for free.

ALL of the information I share is readily available if someone really wants to know. It might take a bit of effort to find out some of the smaller details, but it is out there...you just have to know where to look. So far, the only data I have EVER cited has been from personal experience or readily-available college factbooks. I base all of my hypothetical situations/generalizations on real data, but have never actually divulged the actual figues. Saying that some rate is "HIGH" and another is "LOW" really doesn't give anything away.

As you pointed out in your post, my ". . .brief experiences are of course subjectively valid. . .". When I tell someone what I think their chances of admission at Lafayette are, I am pulling from the knowledge that I have collected from the moment I began my college search three years ago. Three years is a lot of time to gather a lot of information if you have the determination and drive to do so. My opinions are as valid as the opinions of others when it comes to evaluating someone's chances of admission.

Dana's Dad, I know that I still have much to learn about the whole process, but I think I have enough knowledge to answer the kinds of questions asked in these forums with a sufficient amount of detail. I can only hope that the information I provide will prove useful to those asking the questions.

At this point I can only dream of being in the "admissions inner sanctum". Until then, I'll have to settle with what I've got.

J

danashu

Justin:

Great reply to my recent comments. You took my input and responded in a very cogent manner. Keep it up Justin and I'll give you a job in my lawfirm. We are heading up to Lafayette in April for a campus tour and an info session and my daughter Dana is very excited about the prospect of applying to Lafayette next fall. Most likely she will have her interview and an overnight stay in September.


Perhaps you will be our tour guide or we will meet you at the admissions center.

Regards, Dana's Dad

candyman92486

Hey all,

I am just writing this post to ensure the thread does not disappear from the Lafayette College board due to inactivity. There is some great information contained within this one thread, and I want it to remain available to those who have yet to read it.

Thanks!

J

age136

Hi Justin,

I was just accepted to Lafayette as a Trustee Scholar, and am really interested in the school. I honestly can't find anything holding me back from attending except its size- is it too small? are you bored often? are there enough resources available on campus? jobs in town? things to do in town/on campus?

I also am planning on being on a college newspaper, regardless of the college I end up attending... how is Lafayette's?

Thanks in advance for your answer!

Adrienne

candyman92486

Adrienne,

First off, congratulations on being accepted to Lafayette College as a Trustee Scholar! That is quite an accomplishment...be proud of yourself!

Before I go any further, make sure to read through this entire thread. I have already addressed a few of your questions in previous posts (about what there is to do on campus, about the city of Easton), so make sure to check it out. However, I will still try to expand upon my previous comments.

There are 2,300 students on campus. Trust me, you will NOT get to know everybody within a few weeks! Even though there are schools which are much bigger in terms of student population and campus size, I stand by my conviction that this is the perfect size for those looking for the best possible undergraduate education. Remember, it's all about where YOU think you will be most comfortable. I came from a high school of about 1,200 students total (about 300 in my class), so it seems pretty big to me. I think it is great to be able to get to know many people really well, and Lafayette allows students the chance to do just that.

I am NEVER bored. NEVER! Even for such a small school, there are always so many events on campus. You will have trouble deciding what to do when you are faced with so many choices. Also, you can get involved in as many activities/clubs as you can handle. Get a campus job (very easy, many options!), do some community service each week, run for student government, be an athlete on a club/intramural/Division I sport, etc. If you ever find yourself to be bored, you simply are not trying to get involved! The town of Easton is currently being revitalized, and is fast becoming more student-friendly, so maybe you'll want to go in town with friends and get a cup of coffee, eat at an ethnic restaurant, go shopping for antiques, etc. We also offer more than 250 clubs/activities, and if we don't offer something you are interested in, be the founding member of your own organization.

It always amazes me how Lafayette has the resources of a larger university. We have a fantastic study abroad program to destinations all over the world, we offer internships with our HUGE alumni network, we offer students the chance to conduct scholarly research with faculty members, etc. Thanks in large part to our endowment (which places Lafayette in the top 2% in endowment per student of all colleges and universities in the nation), all the resources you would expect from an institution of higher learning are here.

I am so glad to hear you are interested in writing for the college newspaper, The Lafayette. Did you know that The Lafayette is the oldest college newspaper in Pennsylvania? We take great pride in this publication, and it is of the highest quality. It is always winning awards for being one of the best college newspapers (no joke!). The paper comes out every Friday (I don't know how they do it!). Even as a freshman, you'll be assigned articles each week (or come up with your own ideas for articles), and depending on which section you wish to write for, it very well might appear on the front page! You can also work as a photographer, proofreader, or manage the online paper instead of being a staff writer.

I am sure you have received numerous acceptances from other great colleges/universities, and I wish you the best of luck as you consider your options. If you think of any other questions about Lafayette, or just need someone to talk to as you make your decision, keep in mind that I am always just one post away.

J

age136

Thanks so much for your informative post! You really cleared up my questions, especially about the newspaper. I'm actually going to visit Lafayette tomorrow, so I'll be sure to keep all of your information in mind as I look around. I just noticed you're from wycoff! My dad lives there! I live in Morris County, just 25 minutes away... what a small world. anyway, thanks for the quick response

waleedk87

Hi Justin
I am an international student and I've applied for financial aid. Do you have any stats as in how many needy international students actually get in?