Neonzeus

Thanks :-). I'm very relieved. My other kids are pursuing medical fields with better employment prospects, thank goodness. I don't think my nerves would stand worrying about another law student.

lawfuture

Thank you for all of the thoughtful replies. I would just do a mass reply in one post but as it turns out in order for me to reply to a PM I have to have 15 posts. So it would be foolish to say in one post what I could say in four . To the thoughtful poster who PM'd me. I am working toward my 15 posts so I can reply to you, but thank you for the message!

Congratulations Neonzeus, It is great to hear a glimmer of hope about going to lawschool. My S is the kind of student who could have gone any direction but he is fixed on this direction and his undergrad degree will leave him few options other than to go on with his educaton. He doesn't seem at all interested in academia or any other field. So I just pray that he eventually gets to do what he wants to and that the debt doesn't bury him. I keep wondering are there any happy prosecutors out there?

lawfuture

"retake, no question. Study his butt off. Don't "waste" that 3.8. A few extra points on the LSAT can be worth some merit money, or top T6 admission. "

Bluebayou: I love this, I wish I could just tell him that. But in between being snowed by writing papers and reading he has not had time to talk about this. I just learned his goal is to get his aps out early December so for the moment it seems he does plan on applying this year. But once I have a chance to have a conversation I will share all of the wisdom of this thread.

lawfuture

Stacy: thank you for the suggestion about LRAP's. This has definitely been on his radar and was the answer to the question of how he could possibly afford to go to law school and become a prosecutor. I know different schools offer different programs so we will look out for that.

lawfuture

NYULawyer: You gave me alot to think about in your last post. With the ratios that you mentioned how does a student figure out which schools they are a candidate for?

I looked at the data link for UVA. You mentioned that the students that were not in biglaw were left with less than desirable outcomes give the amount of debt. But it also looks like 95 students took public sector jobs. Assuming that UVA has a strong loan foregivenss program this doesn't seem like a bad outcome even if the salaries are less than half that of biglaw. As I read this 85/377 students don't fall into one of those two categories. It looks like 5 of those 85 are in grad school. I guess it is hard to tell if that was their choice or a move made because they couldn't get a job. Looking at the "employment by industry/sector" section I would have completely missed the "fellowship" section if you had not mentioned it. At first glance the numbers appear to be better than they are (even though the public sector numbers look pretty good to me). Will googling Employment Data for recent graduates with a school name come up with similar information from most schools? Are there other hidden categories that might look better than they actually are like those fellowships?

At this point I am completely onboard with him taking time to retest and get aps in early. I'm not sure that he will choose that. The next question is what is the best to do with what we have at hand. Bite the bullet and incur the debt or go to a less presigous school and take a scholarship?

Oh well, thank you for your help.

bluebayou

be aware that every LS has different rules for its loan forgiveness programs. Moreover, that debt will be his until it is forgiven, which means that it will stick out like a sore thumb if he tries to buy a house. Also, loan forgiveness maybe calculated used total household income, so if your S marries someone making some decent money....

Debt vs. scholarship is an individual gamble -- and I use that word purposely.

Good luck.

lawfuture

It does seem that gamble is exactly the right word. As of today S is a little more up and it sounds like he is thinking about going for debt if he can get into one of a few top schools. We'll see, his thought is if he doesn't get a government job he will get a private sector job for big money. If he goes that way I hope it turns in his favor one way or another but it definitely is a gamble.

collegegirlRA

I have a friend at the University of Miami (obviously not top top tier) who has a 3.8 gpa and got a 169 LSAT score and has already been admitted to two top 10 law schools. Good Luck... LSAT isn't everything!

lawfuture

Thanks for the encouragement Collegegirl, it is good get reinforcement about him still being in the game. I wish he were getting his aps out sooner. But I'm still holding on to the thought that if it doesn't work out this year he could be stronger and earlier next year so I'm at least hoping it will work out.

bluebayou

Of course not. It is ~50% of the admissions equation. (It's value increases as the gpa decreases, however.)

lawfuture

I have heard mention of ratios and equations. This may sound naive but is there an actual equation? If so where does one find it to figure out their chances?

bluebayou

there are a couple of sites for Top Law wannabes. And for chances, aka Predictor.

Can't link to the site because it would be a violation of cc's terms, but if you google the above key words....

NewEnglandMother

lawfuture - there are a lot of websites that can provide data to help you estimate your sons' chances. I will pm those to you. Also your son can ask the law adviser at his UG about stats of previous applicants from his college. The information specific to his UG is particularly relevant. I have heard (anecdotally online) that some UG's have successful law school applicants with average scores under the reported medians. Think of it like Naviance for law school (with far fewer data points). Also he can see where he stands among his fellow applicants from his undergrad (although that info is available on his LSAC account too).

Good luck - my daughter is applying also - and I am trying to provide NO guidance (as she desires) so I just research on line and am prepared just in case she asks for advice! Also I like to be prepared for all the financial apps too. Good luck

kwu

LSAT:GPA

YLS 2.30
HLS 3.02
SLS 2.01
Columbia 3.62
UChicago 3.04
NYU 3.60
Boalt 1.67
UPenn 3.06
UMich 4.50
UVA 3.60
Duke 2.84
Northwestern 3.00
Cornell 3.95
GULC 4.28

Well, if LSAT + GPA = 100 percent, then at HLS, LSAT is worth 75.1 percent, whereas GPA is worth 24.9 percent.

lawfuture

NewEnglandMother: Thank you for the great information. Good luck to your daughter. I'm also pretty much trying to figure things out from the sidelines just in case.