cellardweller

That is definitely not the case. Top 12 USAMO scorers and IMO qualifiers more likely.

piccolojunior

I think the problem here is people assume USAMO is enough...but really, you don't get into "star" status unless you qualify for MOP (and the later in high school you qualify, the more impressive it is).

tongchen1226

i dont believe usamo can be used as a single parameter to predict MIT acceptance. almost all of the the usamo qualifiers i know are extremely strong in other areas of school--in literature, history, and even the arts sometimes. i asked a lot of them and many of them told me that usamo is just one jewel on their application "crown." i think admission to MIT works more in the way of "look at the opportunities ive been presented, and then look at my accomplishments." the latter needs to be exceptionally greater than the previous (the comparison is highly subjective at best). usamo is indeed a high accomplishment, but we need to take into consideration if you are from an insanely good school (thomas jefferson, aast, exeter, etc.) or any other benefits that most others don't enjoy.
thats just me 2 cent.

arwen15

OP, I agree with tongchen and cellardweller. Their posts reflect what I
have seen at my school as well.

On the flip side in a school which does offer AMC and hence AIME,
not taking it a single year shows a lack of interest that has hurt
applicants from my school this year and in the past.

MOP/IMO == good, USAMO == nice, AIME+AMC/Just AMC == Shows interest in Math

Narcissa

I don't know what schools you guys go to, but nobody has made MOP/IMO in my school for a decade. However we did have a few USAMO qualifiers, none of which applied to MIT last year. so if I don't qualify, which I won't, does that fall into the category of "had lots of opportunities but failed miserably nonetheless"

cellardweller

There are lots of ways of standing out in your MIT application beyond participating and doing well on the AMC/AIME/USAMO. Many admitted students never participated in the AMC even when their school offered the test. Many students show passion for science or engineering by working on research (supervised or not), participating in science fairs or even tinkering in their garages. You would be surprised to find how many applicants to MIT did not take part in any official competitions of any kind and were admitted.

Beyond strong academics some demonstrated interest in the sciences obviously helps: MIT is after all the Massachusetts Institute of "Technology". With so many strong applicants MIT is especially looking at applicants who can contribute to the culture of innovation at MIT. That is a very broad mission. An increasing number of MIT students are interested in the life sciences, both in research and clinical medicine. Less than half now major in enginering, and only 40% of women. Others are interested in economics and business. Focus on standing out in your own area of interest, not on some model of the "typical" MIT applicant who doesn't really exist. As Mollie had suggested, in your application, through your essays and list of ECs try to answer the question "Why should MIT pick me?"

arwen15

An applicant with uniqueness, vibrancy and a quirky way of looking
at everything is always going to be more appealing compared to
a single dimensional applicant...?

An AIME score or anything else along those lines can be like GPA,
you need to show improvement with time....If you make it to the
next level...cool but that in itself does not add to your dimensions.

Make your area of interest as unique as possible....focus on it like
cellardweller is pointing out.

Adcoms are omniscient, you will be unable to get one over them, so
you might as well be yourself and focus on what you will bring to MIT
that no other AIME-taking, USNCO-cracking, USAPO-dunking fellow
applicant is going to do.

Narcissa

hmm, so should i show my "improvement" in math by putting down my abysmall freshman and sophomore AMC scores?

*dont laugh*
Freshman year: 50~
Sophmore year: 80~
Jr year: 114, 6 on AIME

Nato

Even an AIME QUALIFICATION is something nice to put on your application. I heard an admissions officer say that an AIME qualification is more impressive and noteworthy of 800 on the math section of the SAT

Narcissa

i would believe so

Nato

I heard this from an admissions officer, and it made sense. I mean, at my school there are only like 4-5 AIME qualifiers ayear, and maybe like 15 800's on Math SAT. An 800 doesn't really demonstrate incredible mathematical ability, but ability to not make a mistake, where as AIME requires at the very least high level of mathematical abiltiy (and by high, I mean with respect to the general population).

DataBox

Mr. cellardweller, personally, I believe that your perspective on this matter is incorrect, describing the AIME as something that "does show a certain ability for mathematical puzzle solving, not much else." is simply not accurate. The AIME itself is a very high level assessment that tests one's knowledge and problem solving abilities, and fyi, the AIME does not contain just basic Algebra and Geometry problems...It contains everything from Algebra through Trigonometry and Calculus concepts can be used to solve many of the problems. Now a score of 8 or 10 is decent, but there is always something about taking the real exam...on practice exams I scored around 11-13, but during the real test I scored around a 9-10...most people consistently score higher on the unofficial or practice AIMEs and AMCs than they do on the real deal.

HeWhoDreams, as far as college acceptance goes, the AIME score will not guarantee you a spot at a high level college such as MIT, but certainly will help. There is nothing wrong about doing well on national level tests. An USAMO qualification will further support your case, and all of the USAMO qualifiers I have known have ended up at HYPS and MIT. Furthermore, the USAMO is the most prestigious Olympiad as it begins with well over half a million of the most talented students in the country, whereas, the others (Physics, Chemistry, Biology, Informatics) only have a few thousand. Although, a high GPA and SAT score are essential, an USAMO qualification would most definitely put you in contention for acceptance.

HeWhoDreams

I think DataBox wraps the whole thing up pretty well

thx

dong_xie

"While I was good in math in college, I was nowhere near their level. Still, 30 years later, I still get an 8 to 10 on the AIME under timed conditions. Is it an indicator that I have the talent to become a good mathematician? Hardly! It just shows that I am just very good at logical puzzles."

-- The AIME is more than just logical puzzles. (the last few problems can be Olympiad-level problems --> you have to be somewhat creative to solve them... you cannot just memorize an algorithm like for rubik's cubes/sudoku's and solve #13-15's).

That being said, I do agree that if you prepare for AIME a lot, you can probably get a pretty high score. But being able to put many hours into doing old AIME/USAMO problems requires a strong interest in math and determination.

Narcissa

yeah it does!!!