Vieuxtemps5

hey cosmos what instrument do you play?

I never said you're going to get in trouble because of "tension" between studios, I'm talking about lessening your chances with getting in with certain teachers.

cartera45

neumes - I'll shed a tear with you. Neither my D nor I had any idea that she could even ask for sample lessons until I read it here. It literally changed her whole approach to the search. Her search revolved completely around finding teachers and environments, not schools. Her voice teacher really wants a nurturing environment for her. She also didn't want her in a "tear 'em down before you build 'em up" environment. She has had some students that didn't make it through the "tear 'em down" part. I made the mistake of spending too much time on a professional forum of opera singers at one point. They scared me to death with their stories of ruined voices, politics and mind-games. I had to stop reading.

violadad

Vieux, welcome.

Your posts are insightful and thought provoking. They bring a different viewpoint to the table.

Kinda makes one scratch his head.

This is good. The more insight and experience one has to examine, the easier it is to make an informed decision. That's what makes this forum work.

Perhaps you'll post some background info here
Musicians and Parents - Introduce yourself!

Just for those who want to know "who is this person?"

Vieuxtemps5

viola...

I kind of need to keep my identity anonymous because I am saying things about political situations which can get me in trouble. I'm leaving an influential instructor against their wishes (which includes a lot of summer plans... I'm "supposed" to be going to X place and I really don't want to... there's recommendation letters and other such things at stake) and trying to go somewhere else and I don't really want any difficulty...

violadad

Understood. No need to post any specific identifying info, most don't. Sometimes just instrument, years of study, etc. helps in understanding a bit of background, and puts perspective on a poster's experience or their needs.

Burn no bridges.

Cosmos

vieuxtemps,
i play double bass. there's lots of tension between studios that can cause problems - at least in the bass world. for instance, there's one studio at juilliard i definitely wouldn't want to be in if i were to apply there for graduate school, because i was in two of the other studios when i was a student there, and i just would feel like i was abandoning a certain school of thought if i went into the other studio.

also, for bass players, we have two different types of bows to deal with - french and german. some teachers don't like teaching a player who has learned the other kind of bow because it makes teaching right hand things more difficult. a lot of them can teach both, but it's another issue we have to deal with.

i've been really lucky in that i've had great teachers who i've really gotten along with pretty much since i started playing. if you're looking to going into music though, just take some lessons and find someone you get along with and whose playing you like and teaching style you like.

Vieuxtemps5

O I see what you mean...

I wasn't talking about a technical issue, like Russian vs Franco-Belgian bow technique, or what you're talking about in bass playing. I'm talking about a Stern endorsed violinist comming into contact of one of the (many) people whose careers he derailed and destroyed. There's a teacher at Curtis and a few other places who will NOT take someone with that background, not to mention some conductors and vise versa.

fiddlefrog

Indeed, violin teachers these days are remarkably flexible about their students' prior training. I guess because so many of today's major teachers were trained by representatives of multiple schools, they are better able than their own teachers would have been to teach students from backgrounds unlike that which they provide (if that makes sense).

binx

Cartera - regarding trial lessons with teachers - Unfortunately for most of us, going through the admissions process with our kid is usually our first and only exposure, so it's hard to know in advance what to do! My kid did have some trial lessons, but applied to a couple schools, including the one he attends, without prior contact. (It was a scheduling and cost issue.) In those cases, he was able to use advice from others as to who might be a good match for him. (One of the reasons summer programs can be so beneficial! Those are folks who knew my S's playing, and were able to make school and teacher recommendations that were valuable and appropriate.) Although I don't recommend it, it IS possible, based on his experience, to get in, and have a successful relationship, with a teacher you've never met.

spelmom

I will also add, from a jazz perspective, that my son is studying with a teacher whom he greatly respects and admires and has a good relationship with, though he did not meet or have a sample lesson with him prior. Although we visited his school a couple of times before he applied and sat in on some classes and rehearsals, I did not know at that time that you could request a lesson. However, his selection of schools and teachers was based on the teachers whose technique and style he admired and wanted to emulate, so it worked out quite well. There was one school he applied to where he did not care for teacher's playing, but admired students of the teacher. In the end, however, he decided that was not enough for him.

I wanted to also respond to this earlier post by violadad:

"There are egos that require stroking, there are politics that complicate the process, there is nepotism and favoritism. It is important to be aware they exist... at the undergrad, grad and professional levels. Just like any other discipline or profession."

I am glad this point has been clearly stated and I appreciate the perspective Vieutemps5 has provided because I have certainly seen evidence of this. The audition is critical, and it is important that the student focus on preparations for the audition and not so much on these things. But I don't think the music audition process is any different from academic admissions in that these extraneous considerations do sometimes find their way into the process.

shennie

Also realize that there are schools that admit undergrads without a studio assignment. When son was admitted to Eastman his letter stated that studio assignments would not be made until they knew who was choosing to enroll. Son had another option and did not want to enroll at Eastman until he knew his studio assignment. At that point he called the teacher who he had had a couple of sample lessons with. He wanted to be assigned to this teacher's studio. Teacher called back when son was out for the evening so I got to talk to him. I was very polite but essentially said that we would not send in a deposit until we knew what the studio assignment would be. Teacher said he would get on it and call back within 48 hours. He called back the next evening to tell son that son would be assigned to his studio.

So be aware that acceptance to the school does not always give you all the info you want. If you don't get a studio assignment with your letter and that is important to you, don't be afraid to politely inquire about the situation.

-Allmusic-

Reading this makes me think I need a drink. Oh wait, it's only 2:15 and I don't really drink.

Diet coke, anyone?

jazzzmomm

Allmusic: my sentiments exactly. I'm starting to feel like I sat too long with the other parents at my son's precollege!! Which is really more a reflection on my anxiety over this process, more than anything else!

neumes

Interesting turn of events I heard this evening about a singing friend of son's who is at one of the prestigious stand-alone conservatories. This person is a freshman and has been miserable for several reasons but primarily felt the voice teacher was damaging the voice. After last semester, gathered up courage, asked for sample lessons with several other teachers and changed voice teachers. The former teacher was gracious, the student is much happier. This at a school where egos loom large. So it can be done.

lorelei2702

At some of the conservatories, a former teacher will not be able to grade the student in any subsequent situations, a tacet recognition of potential problems. Your son's friend was wise and fortunate.