mythmom

My D always reported the same phenomenon in dance. She said a kick line, the easiest thing to execute always gets a standing ovation but difficult steps do not.

But I think this is a problem in all the arts. As a poet and English professor I cringe when someone tells me that THE DA VINCI CODE is the greatest novel they've ever read.

OTOH: I probably am an elitist snob.

BassDad

Perhaps we should organize a society of unabashed elitist snobs along the lines of the Red Hat ladies. We could sit together in concert halls wearing something intentionally garish and steadfastly refuse to stand except for the most deserving of performances. Members of long-standing, or should I say long-sitting, would earn the title of Another Proud Elitist Snob and performers would know that they had really accomplished something when the APES stand for them.

Observing our discerning demeanor would give pause to like-minded audience members who, no longer feeling pressured to stand with the unwashed masses for a less-than-superior performance, would remain firmly fixed in their seats in solidarity. These kindred spirits would earn the appellation of APES-in-Training (A_PEST) and would be invited to apply for membership in due course.

In case you have read this far without detecting a slight note of sarcasm in this posting, let me assure you that (1) the first two paragraphs of this posting were written with tongue firmly planted in cheek, (2) I know this will never happen and (3) I want full credit for the idea if it does.

lorelei2702

Sign me up....especially if we get to wear a fun costume....too bad the red hats notion is spoken for, but then we elite snobs would know not to wear a hat in a concert. So, how do we make ourselves known to each other? Lorelei

BassDad

How about ape-themed neckwear? Think ties and silk scarves featuring chimpanzee, gorilla or orangutan motifs. The colors would have to be loud enough to be visible from the stage. It has the added benefit that very few people who are not members would be wearing something similarly simian.

thumper1

One thing we need to remember is that the average person who attends many of these events does see them as outstanding. They don't see or hear the little (or big) mistakes that a music, dance, theater or other performance major might see. DS, DD and I have attended concerts where there were standing ovations...and we couldn't quite understand it...because WE heard the little blips in the performance (largely because WE were very familiar with the repertoire, or in the case of DS and DD...they had played it themselves). The average person attending a concert (I'll use that as an example) hasn't PLAYED the Mahler 1 and it certainly is spectacular and especially so for someone who has never heard it before (how would they KNOW it wasn't a flawless production?). I agree that a standing O should be reserved for spectacular performances, but I think in this day, we see it as the audience's APPRECIATION for their enjoyment of the show. Personally, I think THAT has value too.

violadad

For the identifying garb, might I suggest a mix of some of the more garish flourescent colors so prevalent on small vehicles? Perhaps a combination of lime green, day-glo yellow, possibly on a bright orange background? Easily visible from the stage. Perhaps a few of the ladies have some design ideas?

BassDad

Interesting that you should pick Mahler 1, which was roundly booed at its premiere by an audience that, by definition, had never heard (let alone played) it before. Different times, different tastes, different customs, I suppose.

I think it is certainly true that the level of experience of audience members varies widely and that artists and concert producers forget that at their peril. Heartfelt appreciation is always welcome. It becomes a little suspect, though, when the appreciation is entirely out of proportion to what is deserved.

ABlestMom

BassDad...you crack me up!!!! I totally agree and have noticed the trend and have tried to fight it but just like thumper1, I would really like to see what's happening on stage (no matter how tall you are you can't see in this situation) and sometimes I will stand just for that reason. I will try and fight that impulse now

I'm debating whether it's the progression of my D's voice which comes with heightened expectations of singers, or just the singing quality in general, but I have been very disappointed in most of the Broadway shows I've seen lately (Audra MacDonald in 110 In The Shade being the only exception!). Opera wise we usually stick to the Met starring beloved singers and I have enthusiastically jumped to my feet during bows. I am suprised at the amount of hooting and yelling at opera - it used to be such a reserved (and well dressed!) audience! Are you seeing that at instrumental events as well?

BassDad

I have not seen the level of hooting and yelling that the more popular opera singers elicit these days, at least at the concerts I have been attending.

thumper1

Well...are we going to add clothing to the mix? I remember when going to a concert meant dress up clothes. My kids (and DH and I) still dress up for concerts. But looking around, even on a Saturday night, you'll see folks in jeans at a major concert event.

But then...back in the day, folks used to get dressed up to fly on an airplane (why????).

BassDad...I know about Mahler 1...it was the only piece that popped into my head (probably because I happen to like it). Reportedly that piece was severely boo'd at the premiere. I've never been to an arts event where the performers were boo'd (thank goodness). I find it interesting that audiences of eras past were able to express themselves SO freely. But then again the were the arts critics of the times (no pun intended there).

For identifying clothes...I vote for feathers...you know BIG colored feathers worn either in hair or on a hat (like the kind you used to get at a carnival on a hat with your name sewn onto it...am I dating myself?). Anyone with a big feather can join our section. The gaudier the color the better.

BassDad

Feathers for the gentlemen as well? I think we also need to respect those who may be sitting behind us, so hats may not be quite the thing as lorelei first observed.

ImperialZeppelin

I don't think we need any "unique" identifiers. We'd probably be the ones NOT standing up for a competent performance, and probably the only ones standing up for a magnificent performance of an obscure piece...

And elitist snobs would never stand for unfashionable or garish accessories...

BassDad

Then again, the whole point is that there is not much that we would stand for. (Rimshot, please.)

binx

"I don't know much about music but I know what I like."

The only thing I object to about standing is the peer pressure to stand also. If I want to stand because a piece of music moved me, or I know the back-story to the performers, or whatever, great. And if it does nothing for me, then leave me alone, but don't make me feel like a Grinch for clapping without standing. Standing should represent one person's opinion, only, and clapping hard without standing might mean that person is giving an 8 or a 9, rather than a 10!

Bassdad said early on that he didn't object to standing for kids' performances. That is one of those things that I personally dislike. It drives me crazy to see people standing for a truly awful school performance, just because parents are so proud that little Bobby didn't knock over his music stand.

Then the kids come to expect standing ovations, and the lack of it becomes extremely significant. And the presence of it only encourages them to continue not practicing because they're already great.

Germans are tough audiences, and it is very rare to get a SO. They will clap on and on for a truly amazing performance, and I sit there thinking, "Why aren't we standing?" My kids received glowing reviews in the paper, and several curtain calls on occasion, and never received an ovation.

I don't think I could be a member of APEs because I would feel obligated to stand when the other APEs did - monkey see, monkey do, and all that. But I really want to be a REAL snob and stand only when I want to. I would be the chump among chimps.

thumper1

Well...if we sit in the back row (or the Partare boxes), no one will be behind us...we can use the feathers...and also, no one will see IF we are sitting or standing while we applaud (assuming we DO applaud at all).