arbiter213

Is NU a second-choice school? A look at the numbers » North by Northwestern

This doesn't just apply to undergrads either. I've spoken with faculty who lament that NU "hovers near the top but can't quite break through" and gets the highest caliber faculty but "if Harvard calls offering a job, they take it"

Thoughts on the matter?

Sam Lee

arbiter213,

As far as faculty goes, it depends on whom the person you talk to. I don't know which field that faculty is in, but NU has been doing well in luring top faculty lately, especially in fields like engineering and chemistry. In 2004, NU had 10 faculty elected to AAAS!! It's no HYPS but from what I've been reading, NU has shown upward trend. Not long ago, NU's chemistry was always ranked between #10 through #15 but few years ago, it started moving upward and now it's ranked like #8 or something like that, with 3 specialities ranked in the top-5 (they used have only one ranked in the top-5).

Also, if you look at that list again, NU's yield is not that bad. NU is comparable to Duke but better than UChicago, Hopkins, and CalTech (WashU's number is NA but last year, the % was in the low-30s and I expect it to be about the same this year). I am sure NU would look much better if the list has top-25, instead of just top-15 schools as I believe all the schools ranked after JHU have lower yields.

kk19131

but "if Harvard calls offering a job, they take it"

-Sounds about right. But hey, there's no shame in losing people to HARVARD of all places. Come on, it's the most famous and richest school in the world.

Also, yield is a HORRIBLE criterion for judging how good a school is, let alone how wanted said school is - it's pretty easy to inflate a yield - ask the University of Pennsylvania. I mean, JHU has a 33% yield, Chicago has a 30% yield, Caltech has a 37% yield (yet has, statistically, the strongest student population in the country), Duke a 42% yield, and Cornell a 47% yield. I really believe that the numbers have more to do with the nature of applicants and the fact that they tend to apply to several schools, even when they have very little intention of actually attending each school.

aquamarinee

I know plenty of people from the class of 2011 who got into Ivies, but turned them down to go to Northwestern. I mean, they may not have gotten into HYP, but they certainly did get into the other Ivies.

WCASParent

First, I have to agree that yield is a poor criterion for judging a school's quality. The fact is that NU is rated as a peer of schools like Brown, Dartmouth, Penn, Duke, Cornell, JHU, etc., and I think that's impressive company.
Second, if you take a larger sampling of yields, you'll see that 33% or so is pretty standard for top flight schools, and that NU's yield is not impressive only when it is compared to schools that enjoy unearthly yields.

I think the more important thing to look at is the quality of the students NU is getting, the upward trend in SATs, and the enormous jump in applications the last two years (18% one year and 19% the next). Few top schools can compare to that (in fact, Duke's applications dropped between 1 and 2% last year). Finally, talk to some experienced academics from all over the country. I have been told, by someone who has attended and/or taught at Princeton, U of Chicago, Penn and Pomona that NU is incredibly well respected for its academic quality.

cptofthehouse

I agree with WCAS. I've known a number of kids who have accepted NW over those peer schools that he mentions. What NW has, in addition, to top students is close access to Chicago, a main city, and yet a safe campus.

I think every school loses students to HYP et al. As for professors, many a professor will leave even the top schools if he can get a better deal at another. I know NYU made a very successful bid for a top rate economics department and raided many more selective schools. If you know you the chances of moving up higher in the college where you are working is low due to who is already there with seniority and status, you would consider moving to another school where you would have more say and control. This happens with hospitals as well. It's not just the prestige of the institution that is important. Pay, freedom, control, status, etc all weigh in heavily as well, and are more important in combination than prestige of work place.

dangnguyen

interesting, although I do know some people from NU class of 2011 that turned down Yale, Princeton, and MIT

afrobllrchrs

While students occasionally turn down hypsm to come to northwestern, it's definitely not the norm. I know very few people who didn't apply to an Ivy. Even a lot of ED kids applied because they thought it was their best shot. However, I feel like Northwestern is a lot different than the top ivies so it does come down to fit a lot of the time

icy9ff8

Comparing yields and "other schools applied to" would be more interesting and appropriate if done by undergraduate college. The above discussion seems best suited to comparing WCAS students with the Ivies. Medill students are at the best journalism school in the U.S. What is the yield for the Medill School? The School of Communications Drama/Theatre Dept. probably competes only with Juilliard and, possibly, Yale. Is there a better Radio, TV, Film Dept. in the country? Certainly not at any of the Ivies. With which schools does SESP compete? What about the music school?




























juilliard

Sam Lee

i thought i read somewhere the admit rate was 27% but according to this article, it's 22% (4,852/21,941).

arbiter213

^^ For what?

Sam Lee

^ I am not sure what your question is.

sidjenks

i think same lee was talking about the class of 2011's admit rate to NU

arbiter213

Oh ok- I had heard 27% too. Odd.

elsijfdl

i don't think northwestern competes with HYP but then who does, that's why they're HYP. I personally know dozens of people who turned down lower (and upper) ivy league schools to come here.

more financial companies recruit at northwestern than at the majority of the ivy league.