iAries

@studiomom

Thanks! I've had a lot of long talks about it here. All of my smoker friends have tried to quit repeatedly.

To clarify: I think that your daughter's co-op is interesting sample set. While I don't dispute the figures, I don't think they stand for all of campus, just a small portion within it. For all campus, it's maybe 20%. I don't know if some of my friends would count, the ones who smoke 2 or 3 cigarettes each week. They might, although I wouldn't call them smokers.

Ack! I misspoke. I know about second-hand smoke; I know some folks are really allergic. By personal issue, I mean the vote itself. Regulating peer's behavior is hard, even if people are making choices that are unsafe (to you and them). College, for most of us, yeilds freedom -- we're hesitant to curtail the freedoms of others, even for the public good.

In normal dorms, you're forbidden to smoke within 30 feet of the entrances. That's the rule.

dave72

The rule, I think, is that smoking is not permitted within 30 feet of the entrances of all college-owned buildings. The co-op buildings are owned by the college. I don't understand why co-ops would be exempt.

rigaudon

iAries, I noticed that you said that some people are allergic to second-hand smoke. There is a lot of research evidence showing that second-hand smoke increases the risk of developing cancer and other diseases in the general population.

Secondhand Smoke: Questions and Answers - National Cancer Institute

Plainsman

I'm glad some of you supplied a stat on the rate of smoking in at least one of the co-ops. 60%? Jesus H! I managed to talk my freshman daughter out of signing up for a co-op in her first year but was worried about talking her out of it for sophomore year. This smoking stat will be all the ammunition I'll need. She'll avoid co-ops like the plague.

Smoking is a disgusting habit. The stench gets on clothes and hair and everywhere. The irony is smokers can't detect it, only non-smokers. I won't even let a heavy smoker into my car---without the cigarette. The smell of cigarettes/cigars/pipes on people and their clothing is repugnant. I'm 56 years old and have never touched a cigarette to my lips, not even once. Even as a young twenty-something bachelor on the make, the mere sight of a woman with a cancer stick between her lips or fingers was a total turn off.

I don't know why people do it. I'm at a loss to understand it. Fortunately, my attitude about the repulsive habit has rubbed off on my children. Not even my wild child at big time party school flagship state U will touch 'em.

So much for co-ops, unless there is a smoke and substance free co-op.

mamenyu

Plainsman: Several of the coops are for dining only, and no smoking is allowed inside, so if your daughter is interested in, say, Pyle or Old B, or Kosher Halal, there would not be a similar issue. Coops have their pluses and minuses, and what constitutes a plus may be different for a student than a parent...having eaten a few meals in one, I'd never join it (too much mushy vegetable matter, not enough bread or forks), but my kid chose to stay for a variety of reasons.
As to smoking, I noticed a lot of cigarette butts, especially outside the con - and lots of con students, including wind players and singers, smoke, which is remarkable. Perhaps Oberlin could focus a little more attention on this issue, and publicize programs (nicotine patches, etc.) to help students stop and discourage them from starting.

dave72

No smoking is allowed inside *any* of the coops.

SDonCC

iAries, I liked your answer, particularly your assessment of the curtailing freedoms. Good insight.

I also don't understand in this day and age why kids smoke, either, though....

quaere

My co-op has a few smokers, but they are definitely in the minority, and there's been no controversy about it: there was a unanimous decision that smoking needed to be outside and not obnoxious. (As dave72 said, there's never smoking allowed indoors.) There's an understanding that certain areas outside are smoking zones, although they're not formally designated; the weather gets cold and wet, and we don't want people to be miserable by forcing them far away from the house. But there's enough space for everyone to enjoy being outside without necessarily inhaling smoke, and people do move if you ask them respectfully.

Point being, it varies based on the individual co-op, and the group currently living there. The fact that one co-op in a given semester has a high percentage of smokers is a shaky reason to avoid all co-ops entirely. (And I'm wondering if the 60% figure represents the whole house, or just the people who were at that particular house meeting.) There has also been talk of creating a substance-free housing co-op, pending sufficient interest and available space.

As for smoking in general... I share the bewilderment of pretty much everyone in this thread. I don't understand it, especially from people my age who grew up knowing how risky it is. That said, people make their own choices, and once you get addicted it's not easy to deal with; all you can really do is look after your own health and be supportive of people who are trying to quit.

It doesn't seem to me that smoking is more prevalent at Oberlin than at the other colleges I've prospied at / visited friends at. I've never been bothered by secondhand smoke or the lingering smell, and I'm fairly sensitive to it. I know of a few people who've quit since coming here, and many others who only smoke occasionally. It seems that smoking heavily is the exception rather than the rule.

studiomom

"There has also been talk of creating a substance-free housing co-op, pending sufficient interest and available space." This would be wonderful for those seeking a healthy alternative to what now exists. Has there been a discussion about turning one of the coops into a substance free situation? Many other colleges have done this with great success. Even though there is the 30 foot rule, students ignore it and chose the porch to smoke. So now non-smokers cannot enjoy the porch during meal times or when they want to relax outside. And the smoke travels above to bedrooms so it is difficult to open a window.

Rednorthstar

Pot is everywhere at Oberlin but you can always move to Barnard, the substance-free dorm on campus. Lots of intellectual druggies there, but there's never any pressure to join in. Also pot at Oberlin is usually very expensive. Supply and demand...

rigaudon

Regarding the term "intellectual druggie," I assume this does not refer to someone who is "high on knowledge" but to a certain type of drug user? Why would such students live in a substance-free dorm?

And about the "30 feet from the entrance to a building" rule, does that apply to anything students are smoking, or just tobacco?

I realize those must seem like outrageous questions, but I only posed them because reading everything on this thread and even having such questions come to mind has altered my impression of Oberlin.

I think the original question posed by CBParent was reasonable, but the responses have been so varied/contradictory and have included such a mix of perspectives from parents, students and school administration that it is difficult for the parent of a high school student to make sense of all of it. And since I see that a lot of people have read this thread, I probably am not alone in feeling confused.

quibbler

@rigaudon

The answers are confusing because the topic is confusing (and vast). I find the national debate about smoking and weed to be similarly contradictory. Weed is illegal (unless it's medicinal). Cigarettes are legal (unless you're in New York City). There's a lot of moralizing and health-mongering that goes on in both areas, and topics are pretty grey.

Facts?
- Some Oberlin students smoke weed. Not everyone, not "everyone except for lesbians," and not no one. I don't have statistics on who, or how much people smoke, but from a student perspective... many people have tried weed. *Few* smoke it regularly.
Given weed is illegal, the 30 ft rule is both valid and invalid. You don't want to smoke up in your room because of fire concerns and annoying your hallmates, but you don't want to smoke outside because it's illegal. People approach the issue in different ways.

- Some Oberlin students smoke cigarettes. Yeah. It's legal. It's annoying, smelly and cancerous, so it's regulated. Co-ops are a gray zone as they make up their own regulations. While the 30 ft rule is campus-wide (it includes co-ops), it's mixed with other college regulations that are put up for debate.

Oberlin is not unique, in terms of drug use. We aren't all stoners. We don't all get plastered. (In fact, I think students drink phenomenally less here than at other schools.) But we're more open towards talking about this stuff. We don't keep secrets. So the things you hear are *anecdotes*. Personal opinions. And this is the internet. If you ask 4 people, you get 6 answers.

At Oberlin, we like to talk about it, and we need to, to keep ourselves healthy. At the beginning of the year, there's a show called "The OC" about rules and regulations at Oberlin. It's funny, run by students, and it talks honestly about use and abuse on campus. We're not a dry college, but we're not a wet one. Part of growing up is learning how to consume responsibly. Talking about it means learning about it. Discourse and conversation lead to learning, not secrets and harsh rules.

Disclosure?
I've smoked weed before. I don't think it's evil. It makes the Discovery Chanel even more awesome than before. But I can't remember the last time I smoked up. Maybe in the summer? Possibly in the spring? I don't know. I've never bought weed.

I've smoked cigarettes before. Rarely, and only a pack a month. I haven't since June. I've cut back on my stress level, and any urge I've had to smoke is gone.

I drink, from time to time. While some of my friends drink more than I, it's nothing compared to my friends from home. And as a young woman, I'm much more dubious about alcohol than anything else. Weed doesn't make people violent. Cigarettes don't create dubiously consensual situations. I've never felt threatened at Oberlin. People here are respectful.

This is only my opinion. I am only one person. But I've been here for 4 years, and I honestly love this place. While it's not perfect, it's one of the best places I've ever been.


(PS: I have no idea what an "intellectual druggy" is.)

shennie

I think the other thing to remember about Oberlin is that it has about 2800 students. There will be a wide variety of experiences among them. They are going to tend to hang out with like minded folks.

My son is a senior. He has never done marijiana. (I know this because he had a discussion about it with his older brothers who are both occassional users.) He doesn't smoke cigarettes, he drinks moderately on weekends. He likes Oberlin. He does not feel pressure to engage in activities that he doesn't want to participate in. He has a very active social life. I think that regardless of your beliefs or practices, you can find a niche at Oberlin. What will cause you problems is if you are intolerant of others who have beliefs or practices that are different from your own.

Rednorthstar

My apologies, I meant intellectual druggie in terms of the college, not Barnard House. There are quite a few intelligent drug users on campus, I suppose that could apply to most LACs but Oberlin has managed to make ever top ten reefer madness school list I've ever seen. But even so it is an excellent school, excellent academics, and a very rigorous workload.

Inquisitive Mom

A common thread running through all discussions of drinking and drugs at Oberlin is there is no pressure. People feel comfortable following their own preferences. That is all anyone can ask for.