nefer

Archaeologist,
hmm. Does it mean archaeologists working at Egyptian digs have that level of proficiency in Arabic?

(BTW, in case anyone misunderstood me. I never said Arabic is not useful. Obviously, it's useful for egyptology and elesewhere today. The point I wanted to make was that Arabic is not needed for learning Egyptian. Given the limited time the OP has, he/she would be better served by learning French, German and Egyptian.)

ccTransfer10

Thank you all for your insights. I am so thankful for all the recommendations for books and languages.

Yea I was wondering about how I should tackle the language issue as well..As of now I have had 4 years of Latin and 2 of Spanish so I'm not prepared in any way.

I looked at the Egyptology programs at UChicago, Brown, Penn, Hopkins, etc, and I see that they require learning middle Egyptian and not necessarily other languages. (Maybe I missed something on their websites?)
But I am wondering whether I should wait till after I complete my undergraduate to learn the other languages, or simply one or two.
Thank you, everyone, very much for all of your help and insights!

ccTransfer10

Oh also, sorry I did not mention this earlier, I go to a community college so we have only basic anth and art history courses -- would this still be good preparation?

pwar

nefer: I completely understand your point. However, I find it very unlikely that anyone is going to learn a significant amount of ME before university (cf Arabic). I also find it even more unlikely that anyone is going to learn it out of Allen's book, which is meant for an aid in formal classes (despite the "do it yourself" tone in which he writes).

I don't think we're on the same wavelength with Arabic. Learning Arabic takes a lot longer than German and French, and, unlike the latter two languages, gets you into the mindset of how Afro-Asiatic languages work. In my experience, students really have problems with the basic functioning of the language, namely the transformation of root/stem to the modified word and clauses. People get so obsessed with "Hieroglyphs" that they stop treating what you see as a language which functioned sort of under the script. For the same reason, many universities also like Egyptology students to do Hebrew, although they also add the fact that Hebrew and its closely-related languages records some historical events relating to Egypt.

More and more, though, I think teachers are realising that Arabic can help students the same way as Hebrew, whilst at the same time helping them should they chose to actually practice archaeology. I cbfed discussing it more; point out one successful Egyptologist who now hasn't made Arabic a priority, and I'll concede the point. If you think that Arabic is easier to learn than German/French in the long run, then bleh... The bottom line is that when I was working in Egypt, and when I've gone to a few conferences, Egyptologists will even converse with each other in the language.

And by the by, if you pick up Peust's book on Egyptian phonetics and phonology, you'll see a very well-accepted phonological reconstruction for the word nfr.

ccTransfer10: They would certainly help you with regards to study, but I'm unfamiliar with the application procedure, so I can't help there.

pharmakeus01

Contrary to people urging in learning Arabic, I think you should instead study French. Egyptology started with the discovery of Rosetta stone not by the Muslims, but by Napoleon's expedition. Arabic would be a beneficial language to learn, but it will not suffice as the sole language in its academic research.
Majority, if not all, scholarly works done during the 18-20th century on the subject are written by British and French Orientalists.
Egypt is an interesting place, and ancient Egypt is simply fascinating. A country filled by hieroglyphics and pyramids; later destroyed, vanished from the earth completely. Only to be recovered thousand of years later. How wonderful is that!

Archaeologist

Pwar and I were not discouraging the OP from learning French. In fact, I would encourage him to do so. French and German are required languages for any research in the field. Arabic, however, is an exceedingly useful language to have in addition to French and German.

A typical Egyptologist knows all phases of the Egyptian language (Old Egyptian, Middle Egyptian, and Late Egyptian in both hieroglyphic and hieratic scripts; Demotic; Coptic), another ancient Near Eastern language (e.g. Hebrew, Hittite, Akkadian), French, German, and Arabic. Keep in mind that this is just the typical scholar- most know even more languages.

That's the standard Eurocentric view, but it's nonsense nonetheless. Arabic scholars were doing Egyptological research centuries before European scholars even visited Egypt.

A highly recommended read: Egyptology: The Missing Millennium. Ancient Egypt in Medieval Arabic Writings

nefer

ccTransfer,
If the degree requirements don't talk about French or German, it's probably because they don't expect undergrads to read original scholarly materials written in those languages. Nevertheless, why not start learning either French or German?
I can't tell you about the specifics on college admissions. (I am a computer science professional.) Take relevant courses that your school offers and ace them, and try to get glowing recommendations from faculty members who got to know you. If your application demonstrates your passion and that you actually have a clue, (Having watched Hawass blabber on Discovery Channel is not it. lol) you have a shot at Brown and other terrific schools.

nefer

pwar,
I recall reading that limited reconstructions were possible based on rare phonetic transcriptions found on cuneiform tablets.
nfr sounded like /nafir/, nfr.t (the feminine form) was like /nafra/. or something like that. If a further progress has been made, it would be an interesting read. Thank you.

nefer

One more thing. For me, the most difficult part of learning the Egyptian language was not the hieroglyphs, but was its complete lack of tenses and the complex system of "aspects." If Arabic or (any semitic) language is like that, its speakers would have a tremendous advantage.

Archaeologist

A handful of scholars (Stuart Smith at UCSB, Antonio Loprieno at Basel, the late John Callendar at UCLA, et al) have attempted with limited success to reconstruct pronunciation by comparing Coptic with cuneiform documents. The difficulty with this approach is that foreigners were unfamiliar with Egyptian names and often wrote them incorrectly. You can see this in the Bible, for example, where Shoshenq is rendered Shishak.

nefer

Well, you can't rely on the ancients for faithful rendering of foreign words. I would think the most reliable sources are the cuneiform tablets written by the Egyptians themselves. I guess you just have to keep searching...

mlawrence

My daughter wants to do an egyptology major as well. She is currently at Brown university with their pre-college summer program taking two classes. Both are focused on this major. I don't know know if that would be an option for you but this is an excellent way for her to test the waters and see if that is the right area of study for her.

queencleo14

well im going into archaeology and ive been working at local museums for over a year now... you could try that! its fun and easy

WannaBYalie

Ooh, interesting choice. Very few ppl apply to ivies in classics, and generally, almost all who do are accepted. You should definitely take classes (online probably) that teach Egyptian history, and a hieroglyphics course would be extremely beneficial. Without even seeing your application to Brown, I would say you have a good shot (if your academics are even just average out of the pool). Also, I'd look at Yale if you have a good application. I'm not sure if they have this major, but they allow you to design your own major in some cases, and this would be one such case. Cool choice!

I want to major in bioarchaeology, btw.

ClarityR

Anyone interested in Archaeology or Egyptology should really look at University of Chicago. My son has been involved in both and is majoring in Near Eastern Languages etc and has worked at the Oriental Institute in summers. Originally he applied to Brown, Carleton, Penn, Johns Hopkins, BU, and Yale-got into all except Yale, but Chicago was always his first choice.

I really don't think you need to do all that specific language prep.(my son did Latin and classics), unless you are genuinely interested in doing it in your spare time. What you should do is investigate ways of doing hands-on volunteer work at museums or any digs--it certainly doesn't have to be a dig in Egypt. There are many digs going on in the US and Europe and you can find the info online via sites like Archaeological Institute of America. KMT: a Modern Journal of Ancient Egypt will also give you lots of info online and in their magazine.

My son was interested in this subject since he was a little boy, and just naturally gathered up info about it because he loved it. Definitely ask to speak with someone in the Dept., when you visit the university or college.