FarmDad

As one who supported and voted for Hillary in the primaries, I am nonplussed by her decision to withdraw from the rally scheduled this Monday in New York to protest Ahmadinejad’s appearance at the U.N. As a registered Democrat, I am disgusted by any pressure that the Obama campaign or any other Democrats might have placed on Hillary to withdraw, or on the Conference of Presidents of Major Jewish Organizations to rescind Sarah Palin’s invitation to attend the rally. And as an American Jew, I am appalled the Conference of Presidents caved in to that pressure. It is absurd to argue that it would be giving the appearance of alignment with the Republicans over the Democrats if Palin were to attend after Hillary decided she would not, when it was Hillary’s choice to withdraw and the Obama campaign was free to send instead anyone it liked.

I don’t know if Hillary decided to withdraw because of her own hubris or because she was strong-armed by the Obamas. Either way, it diminishes her and makes me that much less eager to await her second coming in 2012 or 2016.

Ben Smith's Blog: Palin disinvited from Iran rally - Politico.com

StickerShock

Hillary, Obama, and the rally organizers should be ashamed. I was looking forward to seeing a powerful message being sent, with the two most prominent women in America's political scene sharing the stage for a critically important cause. Sadly, it is not to be.

Here's a bit of today's National Review article on Ahmadinejhad's visit:How Not to Toast a TyrantPaul Marshall & Nina Shea on National Review Online

churchmusicmom

Shameful. What a strong message it would have been to have them both there. It would have made me proud...now I am that much more suspicious of and ashamed of our political process.

madville

I don't know the details, but to disinvite Palin is sorry. So much for bi partisanship. If there can't be some symbolism of unification on this issue because of political posturing, who knows what larger issues will be stonewalled for the sake of appearances?

Maybe a precursor on the Dems foreign policy towards Iran?

Obama nation, speak up.

-Allmusic-

I can't stand a thing about the president of Iran and his horrible anti-Israel rantings.

However, the posted blog mentions in the first sentence, not that it is an anti-Ahmadinejad rally, but an "anti-Iran" rally. I find this much more troublesome.

marite

What I read was that Clinton wanted to avoid appearing together with Palin. this is something she has strenuously avoided before, and it has nothing to do with the rally as such; nor is there any indication that Obama pressured her one way or the other. So Obama Nation needs not try to defend Obama or Clinton's decision.

Ahmanedijad is not the most extreme figure in Iran when it comes to Israel. He has come under fire recently for supporting a member of his cabinet
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/20/wo...ld&oref=slogin

It is small comfort, but it could be helpful. There are plenty of other clerics who are more hardline and would be very eager to replace him should he lose the support of Ayatollah Khameini.

drb

"Iran is intensifying a domestic program of radical Islamization on a scale not seen since the Ayatollah Khomeini’s death."

More radical than this?

US Dept of State travel advisory (excerpts):

STANDARDS OF CONDUCT AND RELIGIOUS POLICE: Islam is the official religion of the country and pervades all aspects of life in Saudi Arabia . Public display of non-Islamic religious articles such as crosses and Bibles is not permitted. Travel to Makkah (Mecca ) and Medina , the cities where the two holiest mosques of Islam are located, is forbidden to non-Muslims.

The norms for public behavior in Saudi Arabia are extremely conservative, and religious police, known as Mutawwa, are charged with enforcing these standards. Mutawwa are required to carry special identification and usually are accompanied by uniformed police; however, in some cases they have detained persons even without police presence. To ensure that conservative standards of conduct are observed, the Saudi religious police have accosted or arrested foreigners, including U.S. citizens, for improper dress or other alleged infractions, such as consumption of alcohol or association by a female with a male to whom she is not related.

The Saudi Embassy in Washington advises women traveling to Saudi Arabia to dress in a conservative fashion, wearing ankle-length dresses with long sleeves, and not to wear trousers in public. In many areas of Saudi Arabia , particularly Riyadh and the central part of the Kingdom, Mutawwa pressure women to wear a full-length black covering known as an Abaya, and to cover their heads. Most women in these areas therefore wear an Abaya and carry a headscarf to avoid being accosted. Women who appear to be of Arab or Asian origin, especially those presumed to be Muslims, face a greater risk of being confronted.

Some Mutawwa try to enforce the rule that men and women who are beyond childhood years may not mingle in public unless they are family or close relatives. Mutawwa may ask to see proof that a couple is married or related. Women who are arrested for socializing with a man who is not a relative may be charged with prostitution. Some restaurants, particularly fast-food outlets, have refused to serve women who are not accompanied by a close male relative. In addition, many restaurants no longer have a "family section" in which women are permitted to eat. These restrictions are not always posted, and in some cases women violating this policy have been arrested.

SPECIAL CIRCUMSTANCES: A married woman should be aware that she must have her husband's permission to depart or have their children depart Saudi Arabia . This is true even if the woman and/or children are U.S. citizens and even if her husband does not have Saudi nationality. The U.S. Embassy can intercede with the Saudi government to request exit permission for an adult American woman, but will not be able to obtain permission for the departure of minor children without the father's agreement

Saudi customs authorities enforce strict regulations concerning importation into Saudi Arabia of such banned items as alcohol products, weapons and any item that is held to be contrary to the tenets of Islam, such as pork products and pornography. Imported and domestic audiovisual media and reading matter are censored.

Saudi customs and postal officials broadly define what is contrary to Islam, and therefore prohibited. Christmas decorations, fashion magazines, and "suggestive" videos may be confiscated and the owner subject to penalties and fines.

Saudi authorities do not permit criticism of Islam or the royal family. The government prohibits the public practice of religions other than Islam. Non-Muslims suspected of violating these restrictions have been jailed. Homosexual activity is considered to be a criminal offense and those convicted may be sentenced to lashing, prison, or death.

Persons violating Saudi Arabian laws, even unknowingly, may be expelled, arrested, imprisoned or even executed.

FarmDad

Allmusic, "anti-Iran" was the Politico reporter's sloppy use of language. The rally itself, according to it's organizers, is to "stop Iran" from supporting terrorism, persecuting its own women and minorities, threatening Israel, and developing nuclear weapons.

Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations

Marite, I'm sure the people of Israel feel very reassured by Ahmadinejad's recent comments.

marite

Of course, the people of Israel should not be reassured! That is not the point.
The point is that we and Israel know that there are various levels of hostility.
Unless we are assured that we can destroy Iran, we need to exploit every leverage and every shades of difference that we can find. If we focus on toppling Ahmadinejad, we may end up with someone worse rather than better in Iran.

Sometimes, venting make us feel very good, but can be counterproductive down the line.

FarmDad

I don't think that the point of the rally is to topple Ahmadinejad. He is a clown, and he does not hold the actual power in Iran. But he is the one who will be in New York, and in addition to his own provocative statements about Holocaust denial and cheering for Israel's destruction, he is the symbol of the regime that threatens Israel, exports terrorism, persecutes its own minorities, and suppresses the potential of its own wonderful people.

zoosermom

I want to know why Jews are such reliable democratic voters that they allow their votes to be taken for granted. If Israel is your priority, it's the republican side that supports you.

(Mother is a Jew)

marite

Zmom: Should Israel be the top priority of American Jews?
Let's change the demographic group. Should Russia be the top priority of Russian immigrants? the PRC of Chinese-Americans?
Aren't there priorities that are common to ALL Americans? Like the economy, Social Security, Health Care, Education?

Farmdad: I don't have any problem with American people expressing their (and my) dislike of the Iranian regime and using Ahmadinejad's visit to do so. I wonder if, however, the presence of presidential candidates would be productive. Joe Blow demonstrating is different from VP nominee Palin demonstrating.

drb

For this American Jew, the priority of Israel's long term security is contingent on a negotiated peace agreement with the Palestinians. The republican side has done little to facilitate this in the last 8 years, so, no, it decidedly does not "support me".

zoosermom

Let's not. I am a member of that group through my mother and many of those American Jews say that Israel is a major priority, but then leave themselves no leverage by always voting democrat.

A negotiated peace settlement with the Palestinians. Hmmmm. Wouldn't there first have to be a real government and a commitment on the part of the people it represents?

marite

Zmom:

Okay. Why do you think that by voting Democrat, Jews who make Israel their top priority leave themselves no leverage? Have the Republicans been any more successful? More committed to Israel?