gadad

The more venom Sen. Clinton aims at Obama at this point, the more convinced I become that she's no longer seeking the '08 nomination, but attempting to contribute to Obama's defeat in November so that she can be the Democratic nominee four years from now against a 76-year-old incumbent.

rocketman08

I've lost a lot of respect for the Clintons in recent weeks.

1of42

I'm confused. Everyone's accusing Clinton of being vindictive, of petty racism, etc. etc. But of what she said here, was there anything that was factually incorrect?

Hanna

"How different is this from Donna Brazille saying"

Words that come straight from the candidate's mouth are special because there's no debate as to whether a surrogate is actually speaking for the candidate. If Mark Penn had said what Hillary said, we'd all be arguing about whether she told him to say that, does she believe what he believes, etc. But she said it herself.

tega

He was the state senator for that area, and you can do a search on youtube about Obama and his lack of oversight of the "public" housing in his constituency. These public housing were mainly owned by Rezko. You can also do a search on Chicago Tribune about how he became a community organizer and some of the motives behind it.

I live close to harlem, and harlem has a reputation of being a bad place to live some time ago. The state senator for harlem, the borough president, the mayor of NY and NYPD made a concerted effort to reduce crime significantly in Harlem, and I have to say, they have done a very good job. Harlem still needs some work, but it is a much better place to live than before. I don't agree with you that no one can solve the problems of south side chicago, if the people in charge want to solve the problems they can find a way to solve the problems.

I don't understand how you can conclude from the writings that I hate Obama. Why should I hate him? Can you please point to the instances of my double-standards? There is nothing in his past that indicates that he can change anything, I might be wrong, but I guess we have to wait and see. At this moment he is just not my candidate.

YouTube - Michelle Obama Plays the Race Card

Consolation

gadad, that's right up there with the theory that she gave up her high-profile job and moved to Hope, Arkansas with Bill because she looked into her crystal ball and saw that he would some day be President and that that would lead to her becoming a senator and so forth.

There's a simpler explanation: she wants the nomination, she thinks she can win in the general election, and she thinks that if she points out Obama's weaknesses to the Democratic faithful that she might develop enough of a groundswell to convince the superdelegates to give her the nod. Whether you like her or not, you have to admit that she's a fighter and she's tenacious.

What Obama needs to do at this point, IMHO, is largely ignore her and start running against McCain, while letting his surrogates keep the superdelegates in line behind the scenes. Obama only wins when he sticks to his message of prophetic transformation and stays on the high road. If he looks and acts convincingly Presidential--and if he is seen as connecting to a broad base of voters--he has nothing to worry about from her.

Hanna

"I live close to harlem, and harlem has a reputation of being a bad place to live some time ago. ... Harlem still needs some work, but it is a much better place to live than before."

Funny you should mention that, because while the South Side of Chicago still needs some work, it is a much better place to live than it was before.

Both my parents grew up in Obama's district; we've been there for over 60 years. I am shocked to this day when I drive past some streets; 20 years ago I couldn't possibly imagine new townhouses springing up on some of those lots.

tega

Hanna, just recently, I read in one of the papers (I think it was the NYT) that, there has been an increase in the shootings of kids walking to school in the south side, and some of the parents and community activists have formed a group to give protection to the kids. I think this is unacceptable, kids should be able to go to school without worrying about being shot at.

I am also glad that there have been improvements, but we still have more to do.

I think I have been too harsh on Obama. From now on, I will probably just adopt a wait and see attitute. Maybe he will turn out to be a terrific president.

Hanna

That's not in our district. But anyway, I don't think it's very controversial to oppose shooting at schoolchildren. Most people find that unacceptable.

What's changed is that when I was a teenager (20 years ago), shootings like that happened every week. The South Side has not become Highland Park, and it never will.

vicariousparent

tega: Nice idea. I think it is time for everyone to cool off.

Harlem has a special affinity for the Clintons and rightly so. I admire the Clintons too. Unfortunately Hillary gets lumped in with Bill and so she becomes the candidate of "the past". And this year is all about the future.

barrons

The South Side always had a black middle class core that the much more depressed West Side lacks. Once they removed some of the worst public housing it took off. Also lots of nice homes near the lake that just needed rehabbing plus the UC anchor. The SS was the first home to Chicago's wealthy.

tega

vicariuosparent,

Bill Clinton foundation has helped raise money for a lot of causes in Harlem. Most of the black politicians have done little. Harlem has a lot of community activists who are very vocal in the community, and these groups have done more for the community than the politicians.

I think it is absurd to brand the Clintons as racists, if you know their record from Yale Law, Arkansas, and the White House, they have consistently been at the right side of the civil rights movement.

It was on the news recently that, some politicans are renting cars (I think one was renting a Cadillac) for about $800 a month at the tax payers expense while schools need supplies. This just makes me so angry. We need all the money we can get to fix the schools, and give kids the opportunity to be able to climb up the social ladder. What about an after school program to teach kids how to dance, play chess, play an instrument etc.

A lot of the politicians are just in it for themselves, they don't care about the people

vicariousparent

Uncaring politicians are nothing new and they come in black and white.

I don't think the Clintons are racist, but they are politicians first and will 'play the race card' if it helps her. She is, in effect, saying:

"I am not racist, but there are a lot of racist white people in the country and they will not vote for Obama".

I think a lot of black people feel the same way.

I did too, until I saw Obama win over so many white people.

Remember, Obama is half white. He was raised as a "white" boy.

3bm103

You can't be raised as a white boy if you're not. I don't care what kind of family you have or neighborhood you live in. And white people can't possibly understand that.

1of42

"I am not racist, but there are a lot of racist white people in the country and they will not vote for Obama".

Actually, it seemed to me that she was saying that Obama carried a huge proportion of the black vote in the primaries, which contributed greatly (in many cases, it probably was the deciding factor) to him beating her, but that winning the black vote by such a huge amount wouldn't be as effective in the general. Which is true, is it not?