Graduate students teaching lecture courses at UC

[marcdvl]

Even at a top private school like Wash U, grad students often teach summer courses. (ie they are sole instructor, some don't even have their masters degree yet, but are all phd students), I don't really see the big deal.

[alwaysleah]

One could only hope that a day will come when this archaic and utterly questionable practice will stop. We no longer live in an agrarian society that requires summer off.

Many students rely on working in the summer to fund part of their education. Others gain valuable work experience with internships. Much of my education has taken place outside of the classroom - in labs, at an internship at a biotech company, etc. These experiences helped guide my academic choices and were resume boosters (i.e. college students rely on internships when applying for jobs). Just because summers no longer serve the same purpose as they once did does not mean that they are no longer purposeful.

[LBowie]

I believe xiggi and I were talking about FACULTY summer salaries. Not paying for the 3 summer months is serious incentive for faculty to go out and secure grants. The faculty member gets research money and summer salary, but so does the university in the form of "indirect costs" -- a percentage awarded the university for administration of the grant (i.e. faculty member applies for and gets $100K for research, university tacks on another $50K for adminstration of the grant and the costs associated with doing the research, like facility maintenance, I suppose.)

If as a (science) faculty member, you don't have an active research program, don't fund or mentor many graduate students, and don't care for research grants, you are also not obligated to work in the summer. If you have tenure, there is not much that can be done if you feel like kicking back a bit in the summer, though your fellow faculty members in the department may resent you not being research active and make you take on a larger teaching load during the school year.

(p.s. markdvi -- a lot of phd programs do not require a master's along the way. Many departments don't even award one officially except maybe as a consolation for a student who needs to leave the PhD program early.)

[xiggi]

Even at a top private school like Wash U, grad students often teach summer courses. (ie they are sole instructor, some don't even have their masters degree yet, but are all phd students), I don't really see the big deal.

All are phd students? Really?

[toblin]

Original post:

In the meantime, it is true that some of the people who teach classes in universities might not be allowed to teach anyone above a kindergarten level.

Corrected for accuracy:

In the meantime, it is true that MOST of the people who teach classes in universities might not be allowed to teach anyone even on the kindergarten level.

[terenc]

I think this has been touched upon by other posters, but there is really only ONE main reason why this is the case:

It's the summer. At almost any university, summer classes are taught mainly by grad students, classes that would have been taught by faculty during the school year.

[mathmom]

Want to hear something scary? My husband taught histology to med students without ever having taken a histology course. He was literally a couple of chapters ahead of the students. He did co-teach the labs with someone more experience and he only gave some of the lectures, but still! He had a PhD., but not in anything remotely related.

My husband is very busy in the summer - he's busy applying for grants, reading grants, doing research, supervising grad students, and usually he's got extra summer students who need extra hand-holding.

[marcdvl]

I meant there are no masters students; all grad students that teach in the summer are in the phd program (or are actual PhDs, but focusing on the grad student ones).

[sylvan8798]

Originally Posted by marcdvl

I meant there are no masters students; all grad students that teach in the summer are in the phd program (or are actual PhDs, but focusing on the grad student ones).

LBowie is right, a lot of programs don't have an intermediate master's degree for students progressing to a phd.

[ucbalumnus]

In many other graduate programs, no students are admitted explicitly for master's degree study, although a master's degree may be awarded at some point on the way to a PhD.

[xiggi]

LBowie is right, a lot of programs don't have an intermediate master's degree for students progressing to a phd.

As true as that could be, it still does not mean that all students who TEACH courses to their peers or junior students are in a PhD program. All one needs to do is look at the funding sources for MASTER's degree that DO include teaching and assistant duties.

And again, all one needs to do is search THIS site for stories of parents who proudly describe how their undegraduate child was selected to teach peer students.

If it were really true that only PhD candidates had teaching duties, it would not be the disgrace it is at many universities.

[psych_]

I had many very good professors as an undergraduate, but one of my favorite instructors was actually a grad student. She taught abnormal psych so well that I found both undergraduate child psychopathology and grad school (PhD) quite easy (and as a clinician, I put a lot of stock in those courses as I knew what I learned in them could impact people lives).

Also, having been an instructor as an undergrad and grad student, I got very good reviews in general and hope that my students got what they paid for, so to speak.

For those of you opposed to grad students teaching---how do you expect them to learn to teach before becoming professors without teaching (usually with some supervision) in grad school?

[xiggi]

For those of you opposed to grad students teaching---how do you expect them to learn to teach before becoming professors without teaching (usually with some supervision) in grad school?

Simple. Offer free elective classes to volunteering students. American love discounts and free stuff.

[b@r!um]

Is this common now, having grad students do ALL the teaching at large research universities? Could it be unique to the summer session?

I know that PhD students in math at Berkeley can teach full courses during the summer but only TA during the school year. I know several other math departments with the same policy.

[emeraldkity4]

I don't have a problem with grad students teaching, but since summer courses are not subsidized by the state, summer is more expensive so it would be irritating if classes were taught by undergrads as xiggi mentioned could be a possibility. But I just checked my daughters schedule and she has two instructors that are regular staff at the school.