bbtitle]
» CC HOME » FORUM HOME

Go Back   College Confidential > College Admissions and Search > Parents Forum
New User

Welcome to College Confidential, the leading college-bound community on the Web!
 
Here you'll find hundreds of pages of articles about choosing a college, getting into the college you want, how to pay for it, and much more. You'll also find the Web's busiest discussion community related to college admissions, and our College Visits section!

You are currently viewing the site as a guest.
Registration is simple and easy, and provides full site access.

Join our FREE community:

  • Post and reply to topics
  • Talk privately with other members
  • Participate in polls
  • View less ads
  • Remove this welcome message

 REGISTER NOW

Discussion Menu
»Discussion Home
»Help & Rules
»Latest Posts
»NEW! College Visits
»NEW! Stats Profiles
Top Forums
»College Search
»College Admissions
»Financial Aid
»SAT/ACT
»Parents
»Colleges
»Ivy League
Main CC Site
»College Confidential
»College Search
»College Admissions
»Paying for College
Sponsors
Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-13-2007, 09:06 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 2,252
"A contrarian view of college admissions" or why the process is healthy for our kids

Pam Proctor, a private college admissions counselor and consultant, describes why she is "convinced that the college admissions process is a powerful tool to prepare a student for life." Guess this falls under the category of "if it doesn't kill you first, its good for you"....but she has some good points, and as a parent, I tend to agree that the whole process, while challenging, certainly forces some reflection and growth which has, in our family's case, been a wonderful thing.

entire article:
Pam Proctor: A contrarian view of college admissions : GuestColumns : TCPalm

excerpts on benefits

Quote:
You learn to sell yourself. Most people know that applying for a job requires appropriate attire, a hard-hitting résumé, and a personal presentation that literally screams, “I’m the one for the job!” Yet most high school students don’t have a clue about how to sell themselves.
Quote:
You enhance your self-awareness. Every student has a hook that can make life immeasurably richer in high school, college, and the working world. The challenge is to identify that personal passion as early as possible and learn to exploit it.
Quote:
You’ll develop needed writing skills. Most students are woefully unprepared to write an effective, grammatical high school report or college admissions essay, not to mention a business letter. The solution to this dilemma — even though critics would never admit it — is special coaching for the SAT or the ACT. Both tests now offer essay writing (required on the SAT, optional on the ACT) and grammar/usage tests. Inadequate writing skills must be corrected — in school or out — if college applicants hope to maximize their scores and college opportunities.
conclusion
Quote:
So why moan and groan about college admissions? Instead, we should celebrate the chance for young people to discover their personal identities, build self-confidence and develop skills that will last a lifetime.
Papa Chicken is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 09:17 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,713
The thing is, so many applicants don't get these benefits, and not all of these benefits are tied to the process either. They aren't increasing their self-awareness because they've drunk the Kool-Aid that says that they need to do specific things, which they may or may not enjoy, in order to be admitted to a good college. They don't learn to sell themselves - they make an attempt at doing so, and do it poorly. If they aren't prepared to write a good essay by the time they apply for college, then they just end up submitting a poor one.

In addition, there are a lot of problems caused or exacerbated by the process that she doesn't mention. Resume-padding, for one, but there are others. College applications are expensive, with their application fees and standardized test fees. Kids drop activities that they do like and take up ones that they don't because they think it will look better. Relations between kids and parents deteriorate under the stress. And I've heard of hypercompetitive schools where students track each other's choices of schools to apply to, acceptances, and rejections.
jessiehl is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 09:23 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,350
I also agree that it has the potential to be a good process. Certainly at the end of it, I feel as though I have come through a trial by fire, and that my daughter is a powerful person. Better for the ordeal. And, it is also interesting in light of the recent "60 Minutes" piece about the current 20-somethings who, and 60 Minutes has a good point, "got trophies for just showing up." The process was the hardest thing my daughter did and she is very proud of herself. But it was so laden with hype from all sources. I still don't really know if the competition was/is as fierce as it was made out to be. The media play such a big role in all of this, from the US News ranking to the $40,000 that some families pay to guarantee (?) admissions, etc. etc. I really believe that if the media were not an issue, the process would just be a process, with the same successes and failures. I blame much of the stress on the press.
franglish is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 09:45 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Posts: 1,366
I agree with jessie. The application process will reveal a student's inadequacies, but it won't necessarily correct them. A student who, through the process, comes to realize with regret that he hasn't used his time in high school well and doesn't have a lot of activities, awards, jobs, or whatever to put on the application, can't go back in time and repair that. Yes, he now has the opportunity to decide to make different choices in the future. However, there's nothing about the application process which bridges him, or guides him from the starting point to a better ending place. Will there be someone to provide him counsel on what his gifts and talents are, and where he could put them to use if he hasn't done so already?

The same with essay writing. If the student figures out he is woefully lacking in writing skills, gaining the necessary practice while writing admissions essays is not an ideal plan. Those essays are supposed to be the best examples of polished writing a student can produce. Now, if there's an English teacher who takes it upon himself to help said student, then there can be a positive result. More likely than not, though, that English teacher will be swamped with his own class preparation and grading, not to mention writing his own "essays"--college recommendation letters for his students.

So the application process will be helpful only if the student has parental or school support to help him realize personal growth. And if he has had that available, then he's less likely to be getting a rude awakening anyway.

Also, one observation is that in our school district, the lower level English classes are more likely to offer assistance in application essay writing. Perhaps that's appropriate because those students have lower writing skills than the AP English students. But it seems that the colleges (the state schools for ex.), where that type of student typically applies, don't even require an essay. In fact, those kids deliberately look for colleges whose apps. don't need an essay. It's actually the upper third of the class who need the help with essay writing and yet don't get it, because for them the essay can impact where they end up.
TheGFG is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 10:41 AM   #5
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 927
I do believe the process helped my daughter eventhough she did struggle with the UC essay for about 2-3 weeks.
Her AP English teacher did not correct mistakes on her essay as we found out later, when one of my relative read her essay. I think her English teacher wants it to be in her own voice.
99cents is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 10:53 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: New Jersey
Posts: 2,064
Quote:
But they can learn with the help of a seasoned counselor.
Quote:
The solution to this dilemma — even though critics would never admit it — is special coaching for the SAT or the ACT.
I hope the paper charged her for this advertisement! Her "solutions" seem to involve hiring her. $$KaChing$$.

I think the process can be positive, if the student & family use common sense & integrity.
StickerShock is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 12:54 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,070
I think the fuzzy logic of the college admissions process prepares students well for the job market, finding a spouse, etc., where criteria are muddled and the results are not at all deterministic. And at least finding a spouse doesn't usually involve writing an essay.
TheDad is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 07:21 PM   #8
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 295
I agree with Jessie as well.

"College", not the application process, should enhance your writing skills and self awareness along with preparing you to get a job.
lizschup is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 08:57 PM   #9
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: suburb of buffalo
Posts: 4,171
Quote:
And at least finding a spouse doesn't usually involve writing an essay.
Not so sure...internet dating, matchservices and all that.
paying3tuitions is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 09:02 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Posts: 6,070
When essays can reveal chemistry....
TheDad is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 09:05 PM   #11
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: suburb of buffalo
Posts: 4,171
Yes, TheDad, think too of the Cyrano de Bergerac who can find a ghost writer shill to court his damsel with faux poetry, and hide behind the screen instead of under bushes!

In more serious response to the OP, I found this process did engender growth in my 3 kids. They also got better as they went along, handling deadlines, writing essays, everything.
paying3tuitions is offline   Reply   
Old 11-13-2007, 10:06 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 3,131
It absolutely was a great process for my son--not so much learning to sell himself, but to figure out who he was, what he wanted and what colleges would therefore want him. Major growth experience.
bethievt is offline   Reply   
Old 11-16-2007, 02:09 PM   #13
3Ks
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: CA
Posts: 100
Sorry to bump this up. I meant to thank you for posting this article the other day Papa Chicken. I think the article does point out an important message.

For the families currently in the middle of this admissions cycle, it may be hard to view this as a larger growth process. But I maintain there is a real opportunity to make this process work for students beyond just getting into their dream school. Students who know themselves and understand how they impact those around them have a distinct advantage in many areas of life.

I witnessed a huge growth from Junior to Senior year. As a first born, our older S already exhibited the stereotypic maturity, focus, and drive. Yet our S found an additional gear as a result of the personal reflection and management of his own admissions process. It is really from this perspective that I try to encourage parents to allow their children to take control of their process. They are so capable, and the benefits are great.

And yes, it has a huge carry over effect to the college experience. He continues to be resourceful and enterprising. It’s all about risking, reaching, failing, and growing. This applies to his academics as well as internships and research opportunities. All involve asking questions, e-mailing, phone calling, net working, as well as interviewing, resume writing, and cover letter writing.

Again, lots of personal reflection and decision making. I’ve said it before on these boards, resourcefulness is a life skill. And the admissions process can be a transferable process to the many adult decisions ahead.

Our younger S is a Junior, and he is just starting his own admissions process. He is nothing like his brother in interest, but everything like him in terms of resourcefulness. He will have an entirely different list of schools that are suitable to him and an entirely different process. As a parent, I hope that he will achieve the same level of growth appropriate to his interests.

That’s my positive parenting spiel.
3Ks is offline   Reply   
Old 11-16-2007, 07:57 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,073
very interesting thread, this should be featured
mj93 is offline   Reply   
Old 11-16-2007, 08:15 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,355
This process has become an unexpected rite of passage:

Writing two personal statements was painful, to the point of tears, at times, but became almost a "vision quest" as my D found her voice. The episode she relayed in her best essay was subtle, shaded and revealing. The metamorphosis from the "list of accomplishments" essay to the final work was literally that of cocoon to butterfly.

This was our first time through applications, and when I finally got my DH to quit saying, "You know, it wasn't like this when I was in high school..." everything was fine.
riverrunner is offline   Reply   
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:47 PM.


Copyright 2001-2009, Hobsons, Inc., All Rights Reserved