I feel bad, realy realy bad

[northeastmom]

Instead, she will helping out at a fair at HS thi weekend. Now, do you think the scholarship committee will value her help at the fair more than an excellent essay from someone who stay home and prepared?

No. One needs know their priorities. You also do not think that she will get merit money, bc she got a 34 on her ACT. Frankly, a 34 is excellent. I don't know how much money she will get, how much you want or can pay, whether she will take a gap year or not, but honestly, it sounds like you are too hard on her. If I were you, I would want to celebrate her accomplishments. It sounds like you have raised someone who you can really be proud of! Enjoy her!

[Dad II]

sax, yes, I made big mistakes and I started out admitting that. OTOH, there are still chances for her to make up. If she put in a little more effort in preparation.

I will refuse to pay for state U is the same reason she refuse to prepare for her test. I want to do what I felt like doing. Why should I work extra hard to compensate her lack of effort?

[BunsenBurner]

DadII, what you consider "lack of effort" is actually a lot of effort! Your D needs to be appreciated by her parents not for her test scores or for her GPA! Ultimatums for strong-willed teenages do not lead to gret results. As someone already mentioned on this thread, she could be doing much, much worse things than volunteering.

[Dad II]

nem, is asking D to work on a test preparation or write an essay instead of going to help out a HS fair too hard? You are right about the priority. If her priority is to help others, than why does she need go to college? I am pretty sure SA does not require a BA to work there.

[2collegewego]

Dad II,

I don't mean to be disrespectful but you are sacrificing your relationship with your child because of $. I may sound drastic but I honestly think you need to go to a counselor to learn to step back. Your daughter's ACT score is excellent. Her SAT IIs are excellent. You *should* be proud of her. Instead, you are sending her the CLEAR message that she doesn't measure up. Growing up with that message could have serious repurcusions on her life. You are hurting her but you don't see it.

As far as college and $... The EFC is not from current income. There is an assumption that you have saved for college. That sort of generalizes that your income this last year has been your income for some time, that you have employment benefits (health insurance, etc)-- and I think that generalization is a major flaw in the system. So you have some culpability here-- not just for figuring out your EFC wrong, but for not saving if, indeed, that was an option.

One other idea... I don't know where your daughter is applying, but if she is in the top 75% of many of the colleges where she is applying, it is possible that they will give her a better financial aid package (replacing loans with grants) or give her a merit-based award. Find out if she could become an RA after first year; that would reduce housing costs. There may be other ideas but you need to try to *problem solve* and not just blow up at her. You are allies.

[xiggi]

DadII, while I realize that telling you to relax will remain as ineffective as it has been so far, you can't let the day-to-day events ruin your last months with your daughter.

Unless I am mistaken, isn't she still in the running for a prestigious scholarship she could use at Duke, one of her "first" choices? What is there left to do to prepare as well possible for the selection process? If anything, concentrate on that one, and let the past be. After all, there is nothing you can do about what was not done with all the care you wished.

Please remember that you only need ONE school. Also remember that despite all the horror stories that are floating on the web, students are evaluated individually and holistically. Comparing the objective data of your daughter to what is reported by others is not very productive. While you KNOW that your daughter's information is true, you can't say the same about ... everything that is written. Even if you know the grades and test scores, the issues of character and dedication to learning are impossible for outsiders to ascertain.

At this stage, all you can do is make a current appraisal of your D's situation and focus on things you still control. Take a piece of paper, write down all parts of the process, and scratch everything that has now become irrelevant. The test scores are in and so is the FAFSA. The grades are in. The only thing that can come your way are essays and preparing for interviews.

And last but not least, I really think your daughter will end up at the school she deserves to attend, and that you'll be able to afford it without bankrupting your future.

Everything looks better in May than it does in February. Trust your daughter and trust the system.

PS And yes, helping at a HS fair might end up counting a LOT more than an extra point on the ACT.

[bethievt]

Dad II

You've known for a long time that you would have a higher EFC than you were willing or able to pay. The appropriate response to that would have been to suggest your D apply to schools where her actual stats, which are very good, would probably yield significant merit money.

Is she a NMS finalist? If so, she will get some great offers from some Uni's based on that. You've been on CC long enough to know that, while there are "free rides" out there, there aren't a lot of them. You have really resisted being realistic. I hope she does get a fabulous scholarship to her state U because that's probably her best option right now.

However, I do remember my frustration with my son last year when he wasn't spending every free minute working on college apps. I was a real pain in the behind. Finally, I backed off and he got everything done on his own schedule.

[-Allmusic-]

Did Dad II used to go by a different moniker? He has a familiar "tone" and themes.

And I agree with the posters who caution you against ruining the last months with your D home. If you aren't careful, she will leave and never come back.

[Northstarmom]

"The second mistake was I that I actually beliveve that "Test scores are not that important" stuff on CC."

I can't think of any obviously intelligent and informed CC poster who ever said something like that.

Sure, test scores are important. Having the minimum test score that a college requires for entrance will gain one consideration for admission. For most of the about 4,000 colleges in the country, having that minimum test score plus the minimum required gpa, and the required coursework will gain one admission. For public universities, one's state of residence also is important. Most colleges in the U.S. accept the majority of students who apply.

It's only the most select colleges for which factors like ECs, essays count heavily. Still, one does need higher than average test scores to be considered, and unless one has some spectacular ECs or other desired attributes, one needs much higher than average test scores to be admitted. Still, most applicants to the top colleges have those test scores (and your D's test scores are much higher than average), and most will still be rejected due to lack of space.

I think you should back off. Your D has an outstanding record. If she doesn't get into colleges, she can take a gap year and reapply in a way that expands her options for getting into a college that she would find fulfilling and you'd be able to afford.

[Dad II]

xiggi, that was exactly what I was trying to do. Let what passed be passed but prepare for what is coming up. There is this major scholarship essay competition next Saturday. I simple asked her to do some research and get herself ready for the contest. Instead, as I stated many times, she is at HS help out this fair. This is why I got upset.

[astrophysicsmom]

wow. Originally I assumed you were talking ACT scores in the 20's....That's what most people's definition of "sub-bar test scores" -- assume you meant sub-par. Give her a break--a 34 is an awesome score, and certainly competitive for top scholarships anywhere. I assume that the deadline for the essay is still in the future? Again, having previously (and currently) observed 17-hr-old girls, they can still do outstanding work in a very short amount of time. It has always driven me crazy, and I've lectured until I was blue in the face. But, they get everything done, and for the most part, do an amazingly good job.

I suspect that your D's community service is a great release from the ultra-competitive position she's in at school, and the expectations of perfection at home.

She'll be fine, and things will work out. She sounds like the type of student who will excel, no matter where she ends up going.

cross posted w/ DadII's update: in a high school senior's life, a week is an eternity. She still has time to prepare, as well as do the things that she truly enjoys. Lighten up....life is WAY too short.

[Northstarmom]

"I will refuse to pay for state U is the same reason she refuse to prepare for her test. I want to do what I felt like doing. Why should I work extra hard to compensate her lack of effort?"

I think you're being narrow minded. Your D's very high scores, gpa and impressive ECs indicate she has been working very hard. Just because she's not doing exactly what you want her to do doesn't mean she isn't working hard.

I agree with those who say that unless you want to ruin what probably will be your last few months with your D's living at home, back off and don't try to punish her by saying you wouldn't pay for a state university.

[Northstarmom]

And how would it like it if your D was looking at you and suggesting that you work another job since it seems you have some free time, and that way you'd earn more money to support her going to whatever top college she gets in?

I imagine that you'd feel insulted, hurt, and like you're already working very hard. Well, the example that I gave is similar to what you're saying to your D.

Your D has done extraordinarily well. Stop micromanaging her. Appreciate her for being a wonderful kid. If you want to micromanage someone, micromanage yourself. Show love to your D in your last months with her being a child in your home fulltime.

[thumper1]

I have to ask...just how much better do you expect her to do than a 34 on the ACT? That is an excellent score. Just for the record...I have a kid who prepped for the SAT like a maniac. She wanted to raise her score to be more competitive for merit aid at her top choice (she got a nice package from school #2 by the way). Well even WITH good prep and time spent, her scores did not change very much (30 points total on the SAT).

As long as your daughter had a well balanced list of schools to which she applied (some safeties including financial, some matches, a reach or two) then she WILL be going to college next year.

>>D to work on a test preparation or write an essay instead of going to help out a HS fair too hard? You are right about the priority. If her priority is to help others, than why does she need go to college?>>

This particular section of your post troubles me. I think helping at the HS fair is a very worthy thing to be doing. Getting a perfect ACT score is not worth the stress of giving up other activities your daughter enjoys, particularly since a 34 is a very strong score.

I'm confused...why won't you pay for the state U? And again I ask...does she have a balanced list of schools? If so...let it go and try to enjoy the next few months.

[xiggi]

DadII, in spite of my directness towards you, I really feel for you and understand what you're going through.

The choice by your daughter to help at her school reflects the person she is. You'll never know that it is THIS type of information (which we all can assume was noticed by her recommenders at school) that will help land one of the amazing scholarships. I really think you're erroneously believing that test scores and grades are overwhelmingly important. From my vantage point, I think that you should probably be happy your daughter will present an image that is a bit different from many high academic achievers.

Here's a suggestion: encourage your daughter to spend all the time she wants on her EC and offer to help her jump the last hurdles of preparing for the scholarship. Set aside all the arguments and the things you'd like her to know about the finances. Sell her the idea that the scholarships play a role in the admission decisions, even if that is not entirely true in all cases.

Tell her you are a team and that you are her assistant and that you support her choices to the very end. If she refuses, tell her you love her.

You'll be happy in May.

PS DadII, please realize that many schools are following the lead of Harvard regarding financial aid. You may be pleasantly surprised by the new financial aid you'll receive in the Spring.