Nearly 100 students at San Diego State arrested in drug bust - Page 8

toledo · 05-08-2008, 01:23 PM

In this instance, the sorority girl who o.d.'d was a freshman living in an off-campus apartment. That seemed a little unusual,too. It caught my eye because she belonged to the same sorority where I am a member. When I told my son about the SDSU scandal, he said, "Mom, I hate to tell you this, but your sorority at _______ (a large public here in the midwest) is known to be a bunch of coke-heads." I was shocked. I'd always heard it was one of the more popular sororities at that campus. I'm hoping this was just hearsay from a rejected rushee.

Son of Opie · 05-08-2008, 04:11 PM

Worse that people who drink more in high school do the same thing in college? Replace "fraternity" with "football team", and the numbers would likely be similar. Also, using only one study to prove a point is risky.

toneranger · 05-08-2008, 04:45 PM

How about we replace "fraternity" with "lacrosse team".
Sorry to be sarcastic. But here we go again with frats and sororities getting bashed because of some bad apples out there.
There are plenty of schools without frats and sororities that have drinking and drug problems.
Don't join a frat...there's too much drinking and drugs. Don't join a sports team...there's too much drinking and drugs...and hazing too. Well how about - Don't go to college....there's too much drinking and drugs. Or perhaps. avoid big state schools...there's too much drinking and drugs.
I agree that this is a serious problem on college campuses. But it's not isolated to the greeks or big state Us. A son of a neighbor was kicked out of his college last year after being caught with heavy drugs. Not a frat guy. Not a football or lacrosse player. A very smart English major at a presitigious LAC. He DID have problems in high school though...so it was not a huge surprise.
Drug abusers are everywhere...it's quite a problem.. and it's not just with the greeks.

Son of Opie · 05-08-2008, 04:53 PM

I agree. The makeup of a greek system at a particular school is usually a microcosm of that school's student body.

toneranger · 05-08-2008, 05:02 PM

And Princeton Review's top "reefer madness" schools hardly line up with schools known for having big greek scenes. Oberlin, Reed, Skidmore, Wesleyan, Eckerd.
Stereotypes are damaging. I would hate to be an Oberlin student and have everyone automatically assume I'm a druggie. Same with being in a frat. Not all frat guys are alcoholics! Or drug dealers for that matter.

mini · 05-08-2008, 06:58 PM

"There are plenty of schools without frats and sororities that have drinking and drug problems."

All true. I wrote that myself. I went further. Not all frats/sororities have substance abuse issues. Not all members of frats/sororities have substance abuse issues. Plenty of students who aren't frat or sorority members have substance abuse issues.

But the data is clear and unequivocal - members of frats and sororities are more likely to abuse alcohol and other drugs than non-members. It just is what it is.

galoisien · 05-08-2008, 07:40 PM

Quote:

But the data is clear and unequivocal - members of frats and sororities are more likely to abuse alcohol and other drugs than non-members. It just is what it is.

Because correlation is *always* causation, yes?

mini · 05-08-2008, 09:05 PM

No. This isn't correlation OR causation (I have no idea where you got that idea.) It just is the case that members of frats and sororities are more likely to abuse. I can give you plenty of correlations and/or associations, but that's not the point - and precisely why I avoided doing anything of the sort. The data simply is what it is.

galoisien · 05-08-2008, 09:10 PM

How do you know it isn't that abusers are more likely to participate in frats or sororities?

mini · 05-08-2008, 09:15 PM

I actually assume they are. But that's just an assumption. We can come up with plenty if you like - such as (which I take directly from yours) that fraternities and sororities seek to attract substance abusers. But I'm not going there - if you wish to, be my guest. (I have some closer associations, based on the actual data, but they aren't the point either.)

What is known is the percentage of fraternity and sorority members who abuse alcohol and other drugs, and the percentage of non-members who do the same.

SoCalGal09 · 05-08-2008, 09:19 PM

Just gotta comment... SDSU is DH and my alma mater, and his fraternity is the main one in the news. Back in the early '80s they were a sorted bunch. We avoided the troublemakers and enjoyed the opportunity for intramural sports and socials. Through the years they supposedly cleaned up their act, earning the highest frat gpa on campus. Fast forward, we have a son heading off to college '09. We had a positive greek experience, although it took personal judgement on where to draw the line on "activities". I hope we've instilled the same good sense in our son.

toneranger · 05-08-2008, 10:12 PM

"What is known is the percentage of fraternity and sorority members who abuse alcohol and other drugs, and the percentage of non-members who do the same".
So honestly, you are saying that this study gives an accurate picture of ALL members of sororities and fraternities in the nation with respect to the percentage of alcohol and drug abusers. How is that possible? As someone who has created and managed surveys, I have to believe there are assumptions being made here. Generalizations to a larger population. And those assumptions and generalizations are not always correct. Just like polls are not always correct.
Yes, I believe frat guys and sorority girls drink more. They may even abuse drugs more although I'm not sure that's the case. But let's not hang our hats on survey data here. Yeah, it can indicate general trends. But don't tell me you know the exact percentage of frat members who do drugs in the US. I just don't buy it.

mini · 05-08-2008, 10:28 PM

"Yeah, it can indicate general trends. But don't tell me you know the exact percentage of frat members who do drugs in the US. I just don't buy it."

I don't. The National Institute on Drug Abuse through the University of Michigan's Monitoring the Future Survey, undertaken every year since 1976, and subjected to more than the three decades of testing as to both validity and reliability, publishes the data. All I do is read it. I didn't draw any correlations, associations, or causations from the data (I can, but didn't).

You can, too.

spideygirl · 05-10-2008, 08:34 AM

OAKSMOM: "Uh-oh...looks like some of those parents are going to have to put the twin bed back in the workout room..."

LOL!!!

spideygirl · 05-10-2008, 08:35 AM

Mini: "But the data is clear and unequivocal - members of frats and sororities are more likely to abuse alcohol and other drugs than non-members. It just is what it is."

I am surprised, because I though that on average the people who go too far with alcohol and drugs have some loner personlity traits. I don't mean mainstream partiers, but addictive types who really struggle. That is what I think of when I see the word "abuse", although I guess that word can mean different things.