Schools known for good merit aid

[lkf725]

curmudgeon,
My son had great stats, but not quite as good as S of TheMom (still, top 1% of his class of >500...tests were a little lower). He got $19,400. Also, a few of his classmates with lower stats than his also got $19,400. I think quite a few students must get that one, which is still a good amount.

[curmudgeon]

lfk and everybody, my point is not to compare stats (and I don't believe yours is either) . Heaven knows the OP's kid , my kid, your kid, TheMom's kid are all exceptional students worthy of admission and reasonable aid at all schools. Their hard work and ability shows in their stats. My point is that there are 1000's of these kids chasing 100's of opps. The odds are not what our GC's and other well meaning parents think. These schools consciously waggle these awards out there to attract our kids to apply and it works. They are attracted. There are just far more moths around far fewer lamps than anyone who has not researched the numbers realize. Chance favors the well prepared applicant. Part of being well prepared is knowing the rules of the game.

[quiltguru]

Although I agree that searching for undergraduate engineering will select out some LACs with strong science and math programs, there are many others that do not have engineering programs. Definitely pay the $$ to US News and World Report on-line Premium edition. It's worth it to be able search for specific criteria, like specific majors, say in neuroscience. Also, since your child is a NMSF and will undoubtedly be a finalist, go to the nationalmerit.org website and get the list of schools that offer National Merit scholarships to students who attend. Some large state schools (Arizona State and Florida State, e.g.) offer great merit aid by the numbers...any student with XXX SAT and XXX GPA gets XXX $. There are also several LACs on the list which are strong in science (e.g. Rice in Houston and Brandeis in MA). Good luck!

[The Mom]

I would agree Curm, because many schools that "offer" merit aid, really don't. Kids like my S who takes his education very seriously, and did extremely well, deserve merit aid, but in todays college climate, need is more important than merit.

If you genuinely expect merit aid, ask for specifics at each college as to how many awards in each $$ amount listed are actually given. For example, Case indicates that a few students qualify for the "big" merit award. Define few, please. I started asking those questions last year. I even asked what they did with the merit $$ offered to students who went elsewhere. (That is taken into account when making offers, that not all will be accepted, hence no extra $$ to negotiate out of them.) You may not get straight answers, but it doesn't hurt to ask. The applicant pool these days is very strong. Ask where your student stands. You can still be anonymous at this early stage of the game.

[lkf725]

Right you are, curmudgeon. Knowing the rules of the game would have saved alot of stress and heartache in our house. We heard that spiel and believed what we wanted to believe, which turned out to be a big mistake. The next time, we will be much more discerning.

TheMom...I agree with you, but I could never understand about merit scholarships that depend also on need. What they really should be called in need scholarships given to the most academically qualified candidate. My son lost out on a company merit scholarship only because others demonstrated more need...go figure.

[jack]

curmudgeon: Despite what I wrote in an earlier posting, I still think it's the academics and scores that (probably) initially get a student noticed for scholarship monies. I suspect that the stats of TheMom's kid are fairly typical. So if you and your daughter are really looking only at schools that offer merit money, and regardless of what they post for their stats, I'd certainly strongly encourage her to take that SAT one more time.

And as far as research opportunities at LAC's, I'm sure they're out there. But we know a few kids who were given wonderful internships over the summer and then offered really attractive research opportunities (and yes, at state universities) to entice them to attend. And they did, and it has worked out great. So I don't know about those opportunities being easier at an LAC... just my take. I think people often believe a state university is too big for opportunities lke that, but--in fact--they often have the research monies and big grants to be able to offer a lot more to students w/regard to research.

[curmudgeon]

To all, a quick but still frustrating search on merit awards at Emory (I am not picking on them, it applies to all) yields the following: 2000 nominations for 150 awards regardless of the size of the award. I'll wait till my D gets home and she'll tell you what that percentage is but even a history major knows that it "sucks".

[lkf725]

Yeah...my son applied for a institutional scholarship (full ride) that has about 3000 eligible, about 1000 complete application, about 100 interview, and about 10 offered. Not great odds, but he tried (unsuccessfully) anyway. I think alot of it depends on who reads the application. I know a couple of kids who seem superficially less qualified (grades, focus, etc.) but got farther in the process.

[curmudgeon]

jack, I appreciate the thought about an SAT retake but D is finished with the SAT (and there will be no SAT Subject Tests for her,either). She has found schools she loves where her scores place her in good stead for admissions and awards and she has flat refused to spend her time preparing for standardized tests (since she is already in the 99th %tile for females). She is retaking the ACT this weekend to cure a glaring anomaly and, but for that science score that kept her from a 33, she would have been finished after one there, also.

She will spend her extra time trying to craft applications that speak to each individual target school rather than the shotgun approach. She feels comfortable doing this only because she genuinely desires to attend a couple of schools where she has already received small awards, or has already qualified for major awards that are guaranteed for certain stats. Based on prior winners, the small awards can turn into major awards but no guarantee. That plus having an OOS Honor's College where we can pay the full-freight frees her up to concentrate her efforts on what she considers most important in the process. Which appears at present to be sitting on her hands.


To those who wish to go the other way with this , a 1500 seems to be a "magic number" whether it be achieved in one sitting or several (and D knows this, still won't budge), and no- a 1470 doesn't seem to be "close enough". There are exceptions to every rule, and I know of one very successful applicant who received very nice full -type awards with stats very similar to my D's.

[jack]

curmudgeon: There are, of course, always exceptions. And I also believe--as I said before-- that merit scholarship committees tend to look at the whole person, not just a bunch of stats. That said, I also suspect those stats are what, most likely, stand out in the initial culling. After that, much more is involved. I'm just saying that the stats that were posted earlier are close to what's out there for those full ride scholarships. And don't think for a minute that students with those stats aren't competing also at what you refer to as "2nd tier" or even "3rd tier" schools that, you believe, will be a "sure bet." Just my 2 cents.

But--yes--absolutely--she should do what's comfortable and reasonable for her. And I agree completely that well crafted applications are extremely important.

[curmudgeon]

jack, I appreciate the concern but trust me . When I say guaranteed I mean I have the piece of paper saying "you are hereby awarded" from two of the schools for Junior year awards. The other is a $15k scholarship for Valedictorians/Salutatorians over certain SAT scores which she beats by a mile that has also been verified in writing for 2006. Of the other schools on her list? She knows they are a merit lottery for everybody, even if you are 100 points above their 75th on the SAT . If she doesn't get them, she just won't go. She knows that. Truth be known, she's probably happy just applying to the safeties as her constant refrain is "You know. I still may prefer X (lower ranked) over Y, even if Y comes in close in $".

[Eagle79]

curmudgeon,

I believe there is more merit aid out there than you believe. Take a look at Tulane alone. Their freshman class is 1600 students. The top 35% is 560 students. The top 34% receive an average of $18K in tuition. Particularly for a student applying out of region, i.e. Case if you are from Texas.

With that said, the challenge is finding the right/best opportunities for each of future college students. I know that you are on the right path and I expect that you and your daughter will be pleasantly surprised when the acceptances and associated merit aid is handed out.

[jack]

curmudgeon: Congratulations! Sounds like she can even avoid the "well crafted" applications at this point. All the best..

[jack]

Yes, we don't know any student around where we live--over the last couple of years--who applied to Tulane and did not receive a merit award. Seems like everybody we know who applied to Tulane received this standard award of $22,000. They must have tons of money.

[curmudgeon]

jack, you sound miffed. What's that about? We are all just trying to get by. LOL. I certainly didn't intend that you be offended and didn't take offense when you suggested that I hadn't researched the stats at the 2nd or third tier schools that have caught my daughter's eye. I do apologize for whatever rubbed you the wrong way.

BTW, I don't think I said the words "sure bet", but if I did I mis-spoke. "Sure-bet" is a non-sequitor. If there is a bet, it can't be sure. Some element of chance must be present, mustn't it? If not why would anyone take the bet? And as to your area where everyone get's $22k , last year a top ten % 1470 from our school got zero from Tulane and chose to attend. Neighborhoods must be different. (Of course she was an 800 ,670). Tulane is among the most widely generous. Most are not. See Emory above.