For the first time ever I feel like I have to nag my daughter...

[ellemenope]

>>Enjoy ths summer together and allow her her down time she has earned. <<

Absolutely...because once senior year starts, the fun REALLY begins. Besides keeping up grades that first semester (since they will be sent later to many schools), there's time consuming ECs (by now, they may be in leadership positions in their ECs, so that adds time) and all of the stuff that goes with applying to colleges--interviews, filling out applications, testing, getting letters of recommendations, scheduling interviews, writing those pesky essays, etc.

My kids found 1st semester senior year to be the most stress-filled, mind numbing, grinding experience of their lives so far (they're young). I told them to keep their heads down and grit their way through it--realizing that the work will be all over by January 1.

So, I agree--rest up and gain some strength for the long road to come. Save your ammo for more important things coming up this fall.

[ingerp]

To the OP--you're only a little over a year away from being unable to do *any* oversight of her school work. Best let her get in the habit of taking responsibility for when/whether she does her school assignments.

Your DD sounds like an awesome young lady. Really, you should count your blessings.

[scualum]

My son never read the newspaper either - but always seemed informed thanks to his reading on the internet. I think the teacher's assignment was very 1990s - and I don't blame your daughter for blowing it off...

Seems to me that she is doing just fine. If you want to encourage her to be more up to date with world events, talk about them with her. If she is interested, she'll read up on it - but probably on the internet rather than a newspaper.

[dntw8up]

Trust the job you've done rearing your daughter. She will do what needs to be done to achieve her goals.

[Northernwoods]

Consider this your chance to start backing off of the parental oversight role.

My very capable daughter just finished her senior year and my major regret was the time I wasted nagging her about college applications and deadlines. It soured our relationship and they ended up getting done on her time line, not mine. Everything got done and she did very well in the end. She needed to be in control, a lesson I keep needing to relearn. Enjoy her while you can, the time will go much too quickly!

[menloparkmom]

Newspapers have day old news. Kids who are online these days rarely read newspapers. Like others have said, pull back and kid the kid some space. Your Hubby is right. Find something else to worry about besides your D.

[PackMom]

Neither of mine ever started doing summer assignments until the calendar said August.
Let her have some fun. She'll pull together in the end.

[2Leashes]

Okay, first of all, this is the same teacher she had for Honor American Lit. last year and she really likes her. A VERY well-liked instructor who most Valedictorians can't praise enough in their speeches. The AP summer work isn't a big concern. My D was in something called the Humanities Academy in Freshman and Soph. years, as well as Honors American Lit. last year. They also had a lot of summer reading/essays. So, she's very used to it.

My issues are more about COLLEGE prep, in general. It seems that up until now she's been so focused on getting into a good college. It could be that it's more apparent during the school year when the teachers and counselors are drumming it into them. I realize that it's summer and it's normal to slack off a bit. And, up until this summer I never even brought up her assignments. It's only because THIS is the summer that seems more important with all the college-stuff in ADDITION to the regular AP work. The newspaper-reading is just advice I read on CC as a way to improve CR scores. Then to see her teacher encourage it, I figured they must be on to something.

The thing is, she intends to apply to schools which expect higher numbers. USC, UC Davis, UCLA, Cal Poly, University of the Pacific. And, the only reason she's applying to Stanford is because my husband is an alumnus and I think she's just humoring the grandparents. She knows it's a far reach, but what the heck. But, even the other schools, especially with the economy and lower enrollment, want to see higher test scores. I realize that there isn't always a cookie-cutter rule for who they accept...but I'm just going by what I've been seeing here and elsewhere. Oh, and D really wants to apply to WashU-St. Louis. Now how does she think she'll manage THAT if she doesn't improve her scores? I suppose I'm just concerned that she's decided to take the easier route and not aim as high anymore.

So, that's what my concern is. Hey, if she just wanted to go to one of the CSUs, it would be no problem. I'm not saying there aren't some decent schools among those...but she's been on a UC-track all along. Cal Poly, while a state school, is in a different category. Not to mention that it has a great Kinesiology Individualized Course of Study Concentration in Occupational Therapy (she wants to go to OT grad school.) Most of the CSUs are commuter schools, as well. I know she's looking for the traditional college experience where dorm-life is big.

Anywaaaay, that's the reason for my nervousness. Yep, it will ultimately be her choice. If she wants to be accepted to one of these schools, it will be up to her to make the effort to do what it takes. But, hey, I'm not going to lie and say that I would be disappointed if she allows her motivation to slip NOW, especially after all the hard work she's put in the past number of years.

She took the ACT with one day notice (her h.s school test center was full, so she hadn't studied.) Turns out the proctor told her dad, a fellow math colleague, that he had a space for her if she wanted to take it. It was the next morning. She didn't even bother to study, figuring she'd be taking it again, anyway. Her score was 28, but I don't know the breakdown. I would think with more practice she could get 30 or more.

Bottom line for me: I will do my BEST to stop bugging her.

And now the latest is she wants to work 2nd semester and next summer to save up to go to Europe and take a GAP year! Oh glory. I know this is something she and her good friend (who loves to dream) are cooking up, so we're taking it with a grain of salt. But, she has it all 'planned': She'll enroll and defer admission for a year. She already plans to be an Occupational Therapist, she said. So, she can get into an accelerated BS/MS-OT program the following year. HUH? That's all fine, but I reminded her that first she needs to get INTO a school and who knows if that particular college will defer enrollment??? At least she just get an undergrad degree somewhere first if she doesn't get into a 3+2 program. But, STILL. A GAP year??? We're choosing to ignore this "plan" right now.


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calmom had replied:

2Leashes.... your husband is right. Your daughter is doing fine and you should lay off.

I'm sure your daughter will be able to identify good fit colleges in the fall and get her applications in on time. Her SAT scores are fine for many colleges, and if she doesn't really enjoy reading all that much, she probably would't be happy at the hyper-competitive colleges where she would need higher scores, in any case.

My advice: find some other outlet for your time. I think the AP teacher's expectations are unreasonable, but even if not, this is a matter between the teacher and your daughter.

[2Leashes]

I know this sounds strange, but English is what she does BEST in. She has As across the board on her assignments and has brought home an A+ every year. These have been Intensive and Honors classes. I know she can handle AP English fine. And as I said, she already knows this teacher and it's obvious she can do the work. She got an A in AP Bio and APUSH, so AP classes, in general, aren't her problem.

As for low SAT CR scores, this is what is frustrating. It's obviously apparent that a student can pull off an easy A in intensive language arts classes and still not do as well on timed tests. I feel that not enjoying reading all these years is coming back to bite her. Oh sure, she managed to do just fine in Honors American Lit. and what's that about? READING. (writing, too.) So, she apparently can retain what she's read. But, like a lot of these classes, you do the work expected of you, get the grade and then forget about it. In other words, just because someone does well in a particular subject, doesn't necessarily mean they enjoy it or put much effort into it outside of what's expected of them in class. So something like a timed SAT could easily throw them off.

Who knows.

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Marian posted:


Either my kids require more nagging than yours, or I'm just a natural nagger. Probably both.

But on those occasions when one of them has shown unusual resistance to my reminders, there has usually turned out to be some specific reason for it. Often, that reason was not obvious to me -- and in some cases, it wasn't obvious to the kid, either, until we sat down and talked about it for a while.

In this case, I wonder whether your daughter's resistance to the summer assignments and to your reminders about them might reflect a change of heart about whether to take AP English. Might she think -- especially given her relatively low CR score -- that a standard non-AP 12th grade English class would be a better choice for her? And if she does think that, perhaps she might want to call the guidance department at her high school (they're usually open most of the summer -- except, perhaps, for a two- or three-week period when the staff takes their vacations) and see whether she can get her schedule changed.

As for the SAT, I suspect that she may be dealing with her own reaction to her SAT scores, which are relatively low in comparison to her GPA. It's quite possible that she thinks that her scores cannot be significantly improved -- and she may be right. If that's the case, she may be rethinking her college selections and realizing that some of the schools she aspired to are likely to be out of reach. That's a lot for a young person to process.

[2Leashes]

Thank you, Sax. You put it into perspective in a very thoughtful and simple way. In fact, you echo my husband. I will take everything you said to heart.

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Sax has typed:

2leashes. Here is what you said.


Daughter is a straight A student in honors, accelerated and AP classes.

She is self directed and motivated.

Her AP English teacher has given her a tremendous amount of summer work to compete which you know she will finish.

She is completeing an on line health class through BYU this summer.

She has begun reading the Odyssey.

Your daughters good friends are socializing more this summer.

Your daughters good friend got a higher SAT score than she did.

Your daughter passed up a number of social events during her junior year to stay home and study.

You want your daughter to read more to increase her CR score.

You plan on some college visits this summer.

2leashes. She is doing fine. Really. She needs a break before she gets thrown back into her senior year. She really does. I get tense just reading what she has to do for english class. The teacher should realize these kids need time this summer to think about college choices. I'm glad I'm not your daughter. Let her have a breather.

The easiest and fastest way to increase the cr score is to use flash cards for the vocab. that is on the test. Leave them in the car.

Good luck. I don't mean to sound harsh but I feel bad for this kid.

I also agree with Marians take on her average SAT score and view of herself. I think this shows she has to work very hard for the grades she has. Good for her. She will do great in college

[2Leashes]

Oh, I know there are numerous colleges that will take her. It's just that the ones she has in mind might not IF she doesn't improve her scores. ;-) But, I understood what you said and I'm going to try to approach the whole thing differently. The keyword: TRY.

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mmaah said:

And remember: There are LOTS of colleges that will want your child as a student.

[2Leashes]

I want to thank ALL of you for your kind, but firm words. It helped me to see myself through someone else's eyes. Many of you have gone through it, so experience is always helpful.

As I mentioned before, this "helicopter parent" approach is all new to me and I honestly thank the stars that I haven't had to do this all along! Yikes. I know parents who do and it drives me CRAZY! I looked in the mirror and didn't like what I saw. And, thanks to you parents, it really brought it into perspective.

Now, off to enjoy a much lower-key summer!

[2Leashes]

My daughter just sent me her ACT report. Writing isn't available yet.


Score

Composite Score : 28

Does your score meet the ACT College Readiness Benchmark?

English 34 Yes.

Usage/Mechanics 18
Rhetorical Skills 16

Mathematics 28 Yes. But you can further improve your mathematics skills.

Pre-Algebra/Elem. Algebra 17
Algebra/Coord. Geometry 12
Plane Geometry/Trig. 15

Reading 24 Yes. But you can further improve your reading skills.

Social Studies/Sciences 11
Arts/Literature 15

Science 24 Yes. But you can further improve your science skills.

Combined English/Writing Not yet available

Writing (score range 2 to 12) Not yet available

[MarinMom]

Both my kids didn't do nearly as well on the CR portion of the (P)SAT as you would have predicted by looking at their English grades, for different reasons. In my d's case, she found the SAT confusing and tricky. It is in fact unintuitive for a lot of kids (and you will find a lot of threads here about that), but a lot of the tricks can be learned. She had 3 private tutoring sessions and brought her CR score up dramatically - by the equivalent of over 100 points, as I recall.

My son also struggled with the SAT's "trickiness," but his problem, which affected both his PSAT and ACT, is a visual processing deficit that affects his reading speed. We were fortunate that it had been diagnosed at the beginning of his sophomore year, so his very low verbal test scores weren't a complete surprise. He also had some private tutoring, and he and the tutor very quickly decided not to waste their time on the SAT but to focus on the ACT, which is a more straightforward test. He self-studied for the science section, which is very teachable, and used his high science and math scores to offset the much lower verbal scores.

The reason why I tell you all this is because people don't always understand that low scores on these standardized tests aren't necessarily because the kid didn't study enough, or try hard enough, or work hard enough in school. The skill set required to do well on the SAT is very different from English class, where you are usually not asked multiple-choice questions, none of which seem to be the right answer, and where you are not generally required to read and make decisions at lightning speed. What I'd recommend is that you ask your daughter in a loving and supportive way if she wants to give either the SAT or the ACT another shot to try to bring her scores up. If she doesn't, fine - there are lots of good colleges out there that will love her, including some UC's. If she does, then the first step is to diagnose the problem. Does she have trouble finishing the sections? Does she find the questions confusing? We found that a few very targeted sessions with a knowlegeable private tutor really helped diagnose the problem and find solutions, or at least work-arounds.

BTW, your husband is right in not writing off Stanford. My son will be a freshman there this fall - and his composite ACT score was 30.

[MarinMom]

Posted and then saw the ACT info. A lot of kids get thrown by the science section if they haven't seen it before. The science section isn't about knowing science facts, it's about being able to read and interpret graphs and charts. Fortunately for my kids their hs science classes really emphasize those skills, so my son just needed to practice being fast at it. The secret is not to do any reading before looking at the questions and then reading only what is necessary.

Can you get a copy of the test with the answers and what questions she missed? She (and you) will learn a lot from looking at what she missed, esp. on the reading section.