VandyFootball

I am a freshman at a Vanderbilt and I have been struggling this year. My schedule is
Bio w/labs
Chem w/labs
Financial Accounting
Classical Mythology

I plan on being a classics major at Vandy, as a result I am only taking the basic science classes. For the first semster in Bio and Chem I haven't been doing to well. In the first round of tests I made a 93 in Bio (class average was a 81) and a 88 in Chem (class average was 80). Then in the second round of tests, I started doing a lot worse. I made a 79 in Bio (class average was a 73) and a 69 in Chem (class average was a 63). At this rate, the best I can hope for in Bio and Chem is a B+ or a 3.3, but it will probably be just a B(3.0).

***I talked to my professors about doing badly in their classes and they told me that they didn't think I was doing bad because I am above the class average.(But my grades aren't good for medical school, so why would my professors assume I am doing fine in their classes?)

In my other classes I am doing okay, I have a 96 in Classical Mythology. This class is so much work with 300 pages of reading and a 2 page essay per week. In Financial Accounting I have a 95.

My overall average may be a 3.50-3.65 for the semester but only a 3.0-3.3 for my Science Gpa. Since I am not a science major, I am assuming medical schools will focus more on my science gpa. Am I screwed for medical school?

Next year, I plan on taking orgo, physics, 1 class satisfying my major requirements, and 1 class satisfying my GER requirements. Next year, I wouldn't be surprised if my science gpa went down because I am taking orgo and physics together.

The thing is I have been studying and working hard (tanking my social life and not partying or going out as much as I did in highschool), but I will still end up with a bad gpa. I study approx 5 hours a day outside of class during the week.


For Orgo, I am going to take the class over the summer first at a college near my hometown, and then repeat the course at Vandy. Hopefully this may help me get a B or higher in Orgo.

High School Stats in case anyone is curious:
2250/2400 Sat Score
Ranked Top 10 percent at a strong high school in my state.
3.90/4.0 Unweighted gpa with 10 A.Ps
4.1/4.0 Weighted gpa with 10 A.P.s

arez10

You need to reevaluate how you're studying for your classes. First of all, 5 hours a day, especially as a Freshman, is WAY too much if you don't even have exams coming up. Maybe your technique is what is wrong. For example, Freshman year I used notecards for EVERYTHING, including bio. I just assumed bio was strictly memorization. As a Senior bio major I have definitely realized over the years how wrong I was. You need to be able to understand the broad picture and be able to link two concepts together. You can't just memorize everything. With chem, there is more memorization involved with formulas and stuff, but again you can't just memorize your lecture notes or plug in chug all the time. You need to grasp WHY you're using a formula, and certain trends found, etc. But in short, you should be able to have a social life and still do well. Also, unless there's going to be a curve, don't focus on the class average. Worry about yourself. As much as every kid in your science classes says they're premed, most of those people won't get into med school or even end up applying. So yes, you may be above average for the class, but you need to be ABOVE above average for med school.

I always try to reevaluate my study techniques and better them, and I found this awesome guy who really knows his stuff: Study Prof - All the answers to your study skills, GRE, and SAT questions. Check it out. If all else fails, talk to your adviser, or find upperclassman who are premed to talk to. Good luck!

VandyFootball

^ Thanks for the help arez10. I have been doing some unnecessary studying, for example I take notes over what I read for Bio, and then before the test, I reread all the chapters, but I am worried that if I stop doing what I am doing for my classes, I will do worse on the next test.

Anyone else?

VandyFootball

bump 10char

VandyFootball

141 views and 1 response?

Batllo

You're taking premed weeder courses . The weak will show themselves out the door. Nothing more annoying to a prof than a FROSH premed student whining about their grade after 2 tests.

shades_children

You're seeing it from your perspective, a pre-med who wants to get a GPA good enough to have a serious shot at medical school. If you look at it from the perspective of your professors, they're teaching tons of students. They already know that not everyone can get A's and B's, so their focus is on getting as many people to pass as possible. As far as they're concerned, a C is just fine because a C is still passing. For you, that's not good enough for medical school, but for them, that's good enough to get you through their course. That's why they don't seem to be particularly upset with you getting a B.

And if you keep doing the same things, I think you'll end up with the same kinds of grades. Are you okay with that?

The fact that you're putting in a lot of time and not getting the results that you want suggests to me one of two things:

1) Your time is misspent. You've already admitted to doing useless reading, so put that time into something more beneficial. Ask your professors, TAs, or upperclassmen about the characteristics and study techniques of previous A-earning students.

2) You're lacking in aptitude for those particular classes. This is the option that sucks the most, but frankly, sometimes it's the truth. I earned a B and A- in my two semesters and English, and in retrospect, there's no way I could have pulled off A's in both. I'm not by nature a great expressive or analytical writer, and I just didn't have (and probably still don't have) the talent to make great achievements in writing skill in the 3-month runtime of each course. Considering it all, I worked uber-hard for that B and A-, and those grades represented the best I could do.

VandyFootball

^ I wasn't whining to my professors, I was just asking them what I can do to improve in their class, and after I told them my studying strategy they told me to continue doing what I was doing. <<< You guys are right though, I need to be more efficient at studying.

green4

I can sense the frustration and panic in your post. As a practicing physician, I can speak from experience. The basic science courses that you take your first two years, especially orgo, are "weeder" courses. So many students come to college with the idea of going to medical school and there are only limited spaces. Many, like you, give up after one or two years because they feel that their applications will not merit an admission. This is what medical schools and University medical advisory committees are banking on. Your professors are not pre-med. They don't get it.
Don't give up. If medicine is your calling, just rethink you strategy. I agree with arez10. Rethink your study habits. Put in as much time as you like in the library, but make sure you are efficient. I know you are intelligent...you were admitted to Vanderbilt-arguably one of the top 20 or so schools in the nation. The problem is that every other student in that chem and bio class is just as bright as you. The grades and eventually admission to med school is going to go to those who are driven and obssessed with getting the A, because they can't imagine themselves doing anything else. The medical schools are not going to care that you took a Greek mythology course where you had to read 300 pages a day. In fact, med schools often don't care what college you went to. You could have gone to a school whose average admitted student had a 3.3 in high school and 1800 SATs. You would have been one of the brightest students in that University's "weeder" classes and gotten A's in every science class. So, if you don't bring you science grades up, you are right, the adcoms will see a B- in chem, a B in Bio and that will hurt you. So this is the time to set priorities. If you make it through this year you will be faced with organic chem. Med school adcoms put a premium on good grades in Orgo and it's a class that trips up alot of students on their way to applying to med school. Don't take physics at the same time. Plan your year around orgo. Take 3 other courses in fields that you love and that you can succeed in without killing yourself. Then attack orgo like it was the most important thing in your life. It is actually not a difficult course. There is just a lot of memorization and you need to do a lot of practice problems before an exam...the more the better. It's a course that takes up a lot of time if you want to succeed in it. I know, I got an A+. I was a bio major and got A's bio but not so hot in Chem 1 (B+ first semester but I had mono my second semester and a C+ ..still got in!). The next year I doubled my efforts. The day I got that A+ grade in orgo was the day I truly felt that I might actually make it to medical school.Take physics next summer or as a junior.
Take the time to do extracurricular activities that show your interest in medicine. Plan your classes and your life so you can take a MCAT prep course and have the time to really study for it. The Adcoms seem to love humanities majors now. Bring your grades up next semester, concentrate on getting an A in orgo. I know other will say you are crazy to avoid classes in your humanities that you might love but it will take away from your time that you need to succeed in orgo.
If people tell you that anyone who can't hack A's with your schedule doesn't belong in Med school, don't believe them. Med School is alot of work, a lot of studying but anyone who is bright enough (as I am sure you are) and very motivated to put in the hours, can succeed.
Don't get discouraged. It's a wonderful profession and all the struggling is worth it. When you are finally practicing medicine you will look back on these days and wonder what all the worry was all about.

pacificvista

How creditable is Study Prof? He almost seems too good to be true.

VandyFootball

^ Thanks for the advice green4, I don't understand why so many kids who are pre-professional would choose to go to a top school, when the professors are trying to bring down the average of the class to a C. For example, on my first test in Bio and Chem, since the class had a B- average, both professors for both classes told us that they will make the next test so hard that the class average will fall to around a 60/70, in order to make the average in the class a C(around a 70-75). They said they are doing this because no top 20 school wants to be known as the school that gives out easy As.

Would medical schools cut some slack for students at top 20 schools who have a 3.5+ gpa? I am not even aiming for top medical schools, just want to get into a state medical school. (I am a PA resident)


Haha, its kind of sad, Going from scoring in the 99 percentile on the sats and hardly ever making anything lower than an A- in high school, to getting dominated by my tests and seeing me at risk of not getting into any medical school. Wow, has been a humbling experience. hahahaha

shades_children

You and a bazillion other pre-meds, including me, have had pretty much the same experience.

ZFanatic

You're not alone Vandy.

I'm getting my butt kicked too. I barely opened a book in high school and got into Cornell (not trying to brag, just stating I'm in a similar position).
Now, I'm making B's (+/-, don't really know) in all my classes. The issue was that coming in, I had no idea how to study and how to be effective with my time. My grades sucked at the beginning of the semester. I'm working hard now and have figured out a lot of how this whole college thing works, and my grades are looking up. Probably won't be getting A's this semester, but I know that I can next semester, since now I know how to approach the classes.

The way I see it, is that in a perfect world, I would have made A's this semester. Not that I can't, but I'm pretty sure I'll end up with a B or B+. It's not a bad grade by any means, but it's not an A. But from what I've read, if there's one time in college where they'll forgive slightly subpar grades, it's your first semester, as long as you pick up the pace and make good grades from there on out.

So don't flip a ****. Just work hard, and figure out how to do better. As long as you're improving, you should be alright. Improvement on a B and a B+, up to a B+ and A-, can make a large difference. Take a look at what you're doing, figure out what you need to do to get the grades from here on out, and do it.

VandyFootball

^ Good luck at Cornell Zfanatic.

Thanks for the input shades children.

bluedevilmike

No slack needed. 3.5 is about the national average for all admitted medical students. It's a perfectly fine GPA.