EnemyOfTheSun

If you don't go to boarding school, you can always stay at the local high school. So it's a "HADES or bust" mentality. On the other hand, you have to apply to a wide variety of colleges because frankly you don't have many options.

GMTplus7

But HADES are not necessarily the best 5 schools. They have brand recognition. Does a Mercedes drive better than a Lexus?

ThacherParent

@gmt. Just a stats adjustment. Thacher's admit rate is 13%, 82% yield, 90% SSAT.

GMTplus7

Thacher definitely rocks! Unfortunately, MAGET is not as sexy an acronym as HADES.

Wait a minute... If you add Thacher to HADES, you get DEATHS

DAndrew

A lot of what applies to college application doesn't apply to BS application. In college app, virtually everyone needs a new place at the end of the process while in BS app, virtually everyone already has a place, who are looking for something significantly better than their PS and other local options (to justify the extra costs of all sorts, at least). Also, many parents are comfortable letting thier kids go to a school farther away from home for college than for high school, which means different viable options for each set. There are 3000+ colleges other than HYPMS to choose from while there are only 300+ BS other than HADES...

The point that HADES are not necessarily the best of the best is valid. I think what have been factored in for the "identification" of the most famous schools are large endowment, reputation for academic rigor, excellent college placement and famous alumni. Maybe we should just take HADES as a sample of the schools sharing those traits?

As for "fit", sure it's important when the best fit for you is reachable and affordable, but remember it's such a luxury when you consider the majority of kids' only option is to "fit in" their PS or one of the very few local options. If they can turn out fine, I don't see why one can't survive the not-the-best-fit in a HADES.

2prepMom

The Greene's Guide to Boarding School's says it straight up

PICK A BOARDING SCHOOL WHERE YOUR CHILD WILL BE IN THE TOP THIRD OF THE CLASS

Because confidence, mastery, time for strong extracurriculars all come to top thirders.

HADES does not improve HYP-MS chances. In fact, it is better to be a star in a little known public school than to be below the top 10% in HADES. HYP-MS together do not take more than 60 kids a year from any one school, even from an A/E. Once you factor in the legacies, athletic recruits and "hooks", it takes being at the very top of a HADES class to have a better than average chance at HYP-MS.

HADES offers many wonderful educational advantages to students, which I am not knocking (my child goes to one), but HYP-MS admission is not the reason to go.

BSBound

THANK YOU for posting that, 2prepMom!! It makes me feel that our family made the right choice. Our daughter will be going to a "hidden gem" (though still well-known and highly-respected) school that seems to fit her in every way. She's an outstanding student with a 95% SSAT score, and she might well have been admitted to a HADES or similar school, but we wanted her to feel comfortable and successful in high school. I'd rather have her be in the top 10% of this lovely school than be a less-successful student elsewhere.

DAndrew

^^I agree with 2prepmom on her assessment of the analysis of HADES leading to HYPMS (although that's not why/how HYPMS was introduced for the purpose of this thread). It is a common theme on prep school forum though that HYPMS is NOT the purpose of attending BS, and one should never judge a school's value based on how it helps their HYPMS chances. Just remember, a great number of kids will not be able to make their ways to top 15% of HADES, or top 5% of a lower tier BS, or top 1% of their PS. Where should they go?

@7D, what you said about college safeties is true, but there are other reasons why families don't invest heavily in BS search...

SevenDad

@2prepMom: While my reason for starting the thread was not about the relationship between HADES admission and HYP+MS matriculation, I agree with you about not making HYP+MS admission the reason for choosing one of the super selective BS.

However, I wouldn't say that all of the BS prospects who come across this board understand that the two things aren't necessarily connected.

I don't know how I feel about the Greene's guide advice, though. This has been discussed in other threads before. I personally would not object to my child (first or second) going to a school that really requires her to work hard to even be average. This could certainly apply to my college career at a non-HYP Ivy! But again, maybe this one of those situations where you really can't compare college to BS.


@DA: You were surprisingly easy on me! Thanks.

My point has never been that the superselective schools aren't great. They must be doing something right to generate the reputations, endowments, and applicant pools that they enjoy. It's more that there are many ways to skin a BS education...and to consider only the most selective may not be the wisest strategy if you're truly interested in gaining admission.

As for most people having an acceptable backup in their public high school (with many exceptions, of course), I could argue that so does every high school Senior in their public or local college.

[REPOSTED AFTER DA'S COMMENT FOR BETTER THREAD FLOW.]

GMTplus7

Parents shouldn't have to refer to "hidden gem" schools apologetically. Truth be told, outside of prep school circles, most people don't the difference between Phillips Andover and a Phillips screwdriver.

EnemyOfTheSun

^ True. And I like the way you put it!

DAndrew

Just for the sake of argument, do you care about the opinion of someone who has no interest and zero knowledge of BS? It would probably be a topic off limit anyway. And, people are giving too much credit to the acronom HADES than it deserves. Obviously, not all the applicants to these schools were inspired by the term or even CC to do so thus driving the admit rate down and yield up.

Bottom line: If you seriously intend to go to a BS, apply to a good mix of schools with varying admit rates, but if you believe only a few (and they don't have to be HADES) deserve your attention, fine but you are forewarned, and you'd better have a good backup plan!

mountainhiker

Our son was accepted at the two schools with the lowest admit rate this cycle (13%) - Deerfield and Thacher - along with two other “hidden gems” schools - Loomis Chaffee and Ridley College.

He ultimately chose to attend Thacher. Why? Because *for him* it was the best school. He would have done well at any of these schools, and he only applied to schools that we would be happy with him attending if he was accepted. He did not apply to any other “acronym” schools, because for various reasons, he did not think they “fit" him as well as the other schools.

Yes, I do believe it comes down to “fit” - and I also believe it takes some effort to try and figure that out.

classicalmama

I wonder if the whole premise of this discussion isn't off. The admit rates at all of the schools we've been discussing suggest that students are, in fact, applying to a variety of schools outside the HADES acronym, including those Hidden Gems. 7dad, I'm curious: what's the basis for your concern that they are not?

SevenDad

@classicalmama: My intent in starting this thread was simply to couch the "I'm applying exclusively to hyper-selectve schools" notion in terms of colleges instead of boarding schools. I think the wisdom of the "widen your net" school of thought is more easily understandable when you think of HYPMS vs. HADES. And yes, I understand it's apples to oranges, but they're both still fruits...right? ;-)

Another story that informs my POV....this past January, I chimed in on a thread an applicant had started, cautioning the OP against the “I’m applying exclusively to hyper selective schools” approach. Here is an excerpt of what the applicant had to say in reply: “If I do not try for the schools that make me excited inside, then what's the point?” I'm pretty sure the applicant was not accepted at any school to which he/she applied. Maybe his/her outcome would have been different had he/she considered a wider range? I'm not saying that doing so is a guarantee of success, but I think it can't hurt to try and find some other less selective schools to "get excited about". I know for a fact that there are dozens of "second tier" (quotes intentional and ironic) schools can offer an educational experience that kicks the stuffing out of most public high schools. Most certainly the one in our sending district.

Furthermore, I just took a quick scan of the 2012 Results thread and found the following among the reported results (which I think skew toward the positive, as those with not-so-great news to report may not report at all):

Accepted: Waitlisted: Andover, Deerfield, Choate, Hotchkiss, St. Paul's, Groton Rejected: Loomis
Accepted: none Waitlisted: Choate, Hotchkiss Denied: Andover, Exeter
Accepted: Waitlisted: Denied: Groton, Hotchkiss, Exeter, St. Paul's
Accepted: Waitlisted: Deerfield, Hotchkiss, Choate, Taft; Denied:
Accepted: Waitlisted: Andover, Choate, Deerfield, Groton, Hotchkiss, SPS, Denied:
Accepted: Waitlisted: Deerfield Denied: St. Paul's
Accepted: Waitlisted: Andover, Exeter; Denied:
Accepted: Waitlisted: Loomis Chaffee Denied: Choate, St. Paul's
Accepted: Waitlisted: Andover, Deerfield, Hotchkiss, Choate Denied: Exeter
Accepted: Waitlisted: Hotchkiss, Exeter Denied: Andover, Lawrenceville

Perhaps some of these folks would see at least one school in that accepted column if they had broadened their scope?

And how many chances threads contain language like this: "Chances for Andover, Exeter, Groton, Deerfield, Choate, or Milton?" (Don't check now, the "Chances" sub forum seems to be clogged with NCSSM threads at the moment....)

To paraphrase DA, I have no horse in this race (at least this year). I'm simply trying to help more kids increase their chances of receiving a fat envelope on March 10.