Study abroad in Chile or Spain?

anxiousmom · 01-28-2006, 03:49 PM

Hi y'all. DD is planning to spend next Fall semester in Chile, or possibly Spain or Argentina. For some silly reason I feel more comfortable with her being in Spain - so I thought I'd solicit some input from folks whose kids have done study abroad in any of these places. She is looking at various of the standard options (ISA at www.studiesabroad, IES at www.iesabroad.org, IFSA, and then also a more alternative program called S.I.T. - school for international training, where the kids study then complete an in-depth paper on a topic). Do you have any experience with any of these programs in Chile, Spain, possibly Argentina???? If so, shout it out. Thank you!

interesteddad · 01-28-2006, 05:10 PM

Researching study abroad programs is hard work. There are a few things to consider:

a) Where are classes held? American students in special classes or integrated into regular university classes?

b) Where do students live? In special dorms with American kids? In regular dorms? In apartments? With families? What is the degree of language immersion?

c) Are the programs academically challenging? There's a lot of variation. Some are, frankly, a bit of a joke (see Semester at Sea).

d) What do they cost? And, how does that cost mesh with your home college's plan? For example, if you have to pay full price at your home college (say $20,000 for a semester), then it would be kind of stupid to sign up for an $8,000 semester abroad program! Or, vice versa if your deal with the home college won't cover a $20,000 semester abroad program.

One way to get a handle on the options is to look at the study abroad websites for a number of colleges and see what they are recommending.

For example, of the independent programs, Swarthmore recommends the SIT programs just about everywhere, the Butler University IFSA programs in a few places (including Havana before it was suspended), the IES programs in some places (a friend of my daughter is doing their Vienna program). Two more that seem to be consistently recommend are the CET programs (www.cetacademicprograms.com/) and the CIEE prgrams (www.ciee.org). Look around at the recommended programs for a number of colleges and you'll begin to see some patterns.

I looked at the SIT programs rather extensively and they look really top notch, but challenging. Their basic format includes intensive language instruction, a thematic seminar (for example, studying ecology in Bolivia or whatever), a field study group project, and an independent field study project. Their programs rely on homestay housing for a very immersive experience. This type of program is going to be more demanding that some that feature a group of American students taking gut courses together and enjoying a Euro vacation. However, SIT tends focus their programs outside of the popular Euro destinations.

Europe versus South America is one of those fundamental decisions that only the student can make. Obviously, Europe is going to be thoroughly western and not really an eye-opening cultural experience. The languages are different, the buildings are older, but they are highly developed western economies just like the US. However, Europe will certainly be more comfortable, familiar, less stressful, and a lot of fun.

Another friend of my daughter is doing the highly regarded Hamilton (plus Swarthmore/Williams) program in Spain. In talking with students who had done the program, the concensus was that the courses were a still a bit of a vacation academically. But, this program is full language immersion, with all courses conducted in Spanish, and housing is homestay with Spanish families.

anxiousmom · 01-28-2006, 05:56 PM

Thanks for that great info, Interestedad - Your post will be usefull for all parents and students considering Study Abroad. All the programs I've listed are on the automatically approved list for Rice, so I know that they are fine. All of the Chilean ones have homestay options, some have direct enrollment in the Chilean U's (which seem to have a very small number of international students there.). I am hoping there are some more people out here with some direct knowledge of these programs, or anecdotes of their kid's experiences in these locations. Keep them coming!

Mombot · 01-28-2006, 08:52 PM

You got a better, more rational answer from interesteddad than you'll get from me, another anxious mom, but I would vote for Chile. No Islamists blowing up the subways.

I am probably way overreacting, but until we get rid of W. Americans in Europe are going to be targets.

Edit: I just saw the reference to Argentina and my vote would be for that over Spain as well.

Not only the relative insulation from the current anti-U.S. sentiment in large immigrant communities, but your kids are going to be in the world for another 70 years or so. Try to think of the geopolitical balance in 25 or 30 years. Europe will continue to fade in influence; South America has many emerging markets and a rapidly stabilizing political scene. Familiarity with South America will be a huge plus in business in the next 10-25 years. Spain is a relatively small player in a fading area of the world.

interesteddad · 01-28-2006, 09:32 PM

mombot:

I don't think you can live like that. The odds of getting swept up in a terror attack in Europe are infinitesimally small. If that dictates plans, they you have to avoid NYC, too. And, probably think twice about crossing the street.

Also, I don't think the name on the mailbox at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave makes one iota of difference to fundamentalist terror cells.

momrath · 01-28-2006, 10:32 PM

I've traveled extensively in Europe and I live in what for lack of a better term I'll call an undeveloped country. Although I love Spain and have never been to Chile, I would counsel your daughter to go for South America. Europe, notwithstanding terrorist attacks, is going to be there. It's accessible for fun and study at any age. (I recently spent a week in Madrid, mostly at the Prado.)

But Chile and the undeveloped world are far more difficult to encounter on your own. The opportunity to travel with a student group, stay with a family, study with academics might not come up again. Seize it!

Again, I don't have any particular preference for or against Chile. I'm an Asian specialist and would like to see more JYA travel to this neck of the woods. But the point I feel stongly about is the importance of having exposure to a third world culture. It will change the way you think, the way you feel, the way your see America and Europe, the way you approach your everyday life. It will enhance your world view and deepen your understanding of humanity in ways that you can't imagine without having been there.

A word on terrorism (as much as I wish this trend weren't taking off on the "who began it" tangent): I live in a country that has been afflicted by terrible terrorist attacks, but still I say don't let this influence your decision to travel. The chance of being injured or even inconvenienced by terrorism is infintestimal. The whole point of terrorism is surprise and to try to outthink it will lead to intense under-the-bed syndrome.

anxiousmom · 01-29-2006, 02:35 PM

"Under the bed syndrome"

That's a nice way to say it! DD is very interested in Chile, especially with the new female prez - so I bet she'll choose it over Spain. She doesn't want to go and hang out somewhere and take it easy sightseeing (which I'd rather do!).

galwaymom · 01-29-2006, 03:55 PM

Anxiousmom- I'm adding my comments not because I have particular expertise in the university programs in Chile, but because I have traveled there with my family, staying with the family of good friends of ours in Santiago and Vina del Mar. Our Chilean friend is a university professor here in the US, and we have learned alot about the strong academics in Chile. It was a fabulous trip, and the Chilean people we met from all walks of life were absolutely wonderful. We also came across alot of students from many countries traveling easily around Chile. From what I know, I would say that your daughter would have a fantastic experience.

kelsa · 01-29-2006, 04:18 PM

FWIW: I was a foreign exchange student in Chile in 1975, the summer before starting college. I'm left with many strong impressions, but perhaps the most striking was how European it seemed. Many Chilenos are of German, Spanish and other European heritage. The cities of Concepcion and Santiago were very cosmopolitan. And the scenery was breathtaking. I'll put in my vote for Chile.

Mombot · 01-30-2006, 10:17 PM

FWIW, the images of South America as "underdeveloped" are probably outdated. From what I have read, which isn't much, economic development in many South American countries has been rapid since the '80s. Go online and read about it anxious--you'd probably be pleasantly surprised. Your D would have a great experience.

I wouldn't not go to Europe because of terrorists, but if I had to pick a country to live in for a year and I got to pick between Chile and Spain which both have positives, I'd take the lack of proximity to groups blowing up subways as a bonus.

interesteddad · 01-30-2006, 10:41 PM

Quote:

FWIW, the images of South America as "underdeveloped" are probably outdated. From what I have read, which isn't much, economic development in many South American countries has been rapid since the '80s.

The growth rates in many of the "developing" countries are staggering. For example, China's GDP has grown 10% annually for the last decade. That is incomprehensible. I heard that something like one quarter of all the contruction cranes in the world are current in use in Shanghai. Along with this growth is an unprecedented movement of populations from rural regions to urban areas -- a phenomena occuring in South America, Africa, India, and Asia.

To me, seeing this kind of sweeping change first hand would be one major reason to pick South America over a country with a fully mature western economy.

Here's a link to a list of the largest urban areas in the world. Interesting reading:

http://www.mongabay.com/igapo/2005_w..._urban_01.html

anxiousmom · 01-31-2006, 08:58 PM

And now she is talking Venezuala! (Spelling?) Aggg!!!!!

Mombot · 01-31-2006, 10:02 PM

Chile is sooo much nicer. Venezuela is tropical; southern Venezuela is near the equator but the whole country is in the northern hemisphere. Chile runs all the way down the west coast of S. America and has deserts and mountains and forests and is stunningly amazingly beautiful. You have 2600 miles of coastline and the Andes--all in one country.

Little Mother · 02-01-2006, 07:42 AM

A friend whose S is a sophomore at Harvard spent last summer teaching school (as a volunteer) in Chile. He's a Latin American Studies major and found the experience exhilirating. And yes, he returned home safely.

My D, who's interested in majoring in Latin American Studies, has talked about studying abroad in Cuba!

SuNa · 02-01-2006, 07:45 AM

Chile isn't a third world country. My husband travels there a lot and we have friends from there. It's a real up-and-comer in the world. I think the country's diversity of landscape would be fascinating, and its people quite European in outlook.

I have yet to hear of an overseas study program that is academically demanding.