ssattler07

my cousin is a priest at ND and HE even took me and showed me around and showed me the muslim worship room. it was really cool - they are VERY tolerant if not accepting of all religions

mattistotle

The pope agreed on microscale evolution, such as the evolution of bacteria to become drug-resistant and such.....not macroscale evolution which entails speciation. Macroscale evolution and 6-10 year old earth dont go together too well. Alos what about human evolution, its pretty much an accepted fact in the overall biology community, but i feel at Notre Dame this concept might be a little less accepted, since it kinda ruins the whole adam and eve thing.

docmom

Matt, I posted a whole thing and may have to post it again. And, PLEASE provide a link to substantiate what you're saying about the micro/macro distinction - I have never heard this distinction and I pay attention to Catholic issues. I believe the pope is *open* to whatever science proves, and he is therefore not endorsing or denying evolution.

The Catholic Church, and thus Notre Dame, do not believe in taking everything in the bible exactly literally. This is just a fact.

If there's a God who created us, he is outside of us and the physical world and thus outside of and also the creator of what we term Science. I'm pretty sure he could design us however he wanted to. Intelligent design should not conflict with the theory of evolution - fundamentalist Christians believe they are mutually exclusive, not Catholics. I don't know what you're referring to when you talk about the 6-10 year old earth. Better provide a link for that, too.

Here is what I posted before. This is from this link:
http://www.newadvent.org/library/docs_jp02tc.htm

Address of Pope John Paul II to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences (October 22, 1996)

3. Before offering you several reflections that more specifically concern the subject of the origin of life and its evolution, I would like to remind you that the magisterium of the Church has already made pronouncements on these matters within the framework of her own competence. I will cite here two interventions.

In his encyclical Humani Generis (1950), my predecessor Pius XII had already stated that there was no opposition between evolution and the doctrine of the faith about man and his vocation, on condition that one did not lose sight of several indisputable points.

For my part, when I received those taking part in your academy's plenary assembly on October 31, 1992, I had the opportunity with regard to Galileo to draw attention to the need of a rigorous hermeneutic for the correct interpretation of the inspired word. It is necessary to determine the proper sense of Scripture, while avoiding any unwarranted interpretations that make it say what it does not intend to say. In order to delineate the field of their own study, the exegete and the theologian must keep informed about the results achieved by the natural sciences (cf. AAS 85 1/81993 3/8, pp. 764-772; address to the Pontifical Biblical Commission, April 23, 1993, announcing the document on the The Interpretation of the Bible in the Church: AAS 86 1/81994 3/8, pp. 232-243).

Also - see this link - it was cached on google so I hope it works:
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache...volution&hl=en

I'll be interested to see your links. Please make sure they are Catholic links supporting and representing themselves about what Catholics believe instead of non-Catholics guessing about or making up what Catholics believe, which is a widespread occurrence.

Now, if you want to continue this discussion I think you should pm me so we don't hijack this thread. But I hope it clarifies the Catholic, and thus Notre Dame as a Catholic institution's, position on evolution for the purposes of this board.

drummerdude_07

Ok polo the importance in politics in colleges is huge. Why? Because something over 90% of all top college profs. are liberal, and not Bill Clinton liberal, but Karl Marx liberal. We're talking test questions that ask "why is Bush a war criminal", liberals walking around tearing down signs for a conservative event while taunting anyone who reads them. Professors rolling on the floor screaming "the corporations are murdering you". Guys like Ward Churchill in CO who compare the VICTIMS of 9/11 to Nazis. Insane oppressive political correctness rules forbidding you to use certain "offensive words" like black or homosexual. Professors who give assignments or extra credit for attending PETA protests. And yes, WAY TOO MANY of these professors who actually blame the United States for 9/11, advocate that Bush be assasinated, and push for a Communist overthrough of the government. Now I have lots of friends who are liberal compared to me, and are faithful Deomcrats. Hell, some of them even take Michael Moore seriously and joke about Bush dying. But they are Rush Limbaugh compared to the sad state of affairs on many, if not most, campuses in America.

octalc0de

Then they are against stem cell research. Adult stem cells are, by definition, less useful than fetal stem cells: adult stem cells have differentiated into particular types of stem cells (e.g., pluripotential hemopoietic stem cells, found in the bone marrow, only develop into cells that form a component of blood), whereas fetal stem cells have the capability of developing into any other cell.

nemo2001

is there a good reason we resurrected this post...it's been dead for almost 9 months?

octalc0de

It was a "featured" discussion. Whoooops.

shellzie2006

Well, since it has been revived, it may be worth noting that umbilical cord stem cells can be used as well- which are very simlar in nature to fetal stem cells.

ghippleh

This thread has so many errors I don't even know where to begin. You all need to do your homework before you post this nonsense.

irish68178

that tends to happen in a debate, but thanks for your analysis ghippleh. I am not sure what errors you are talking about but it is good to know that you are above the other posters and superior. I bow before you.

Seriously though, if there are mistakes that you see then challenge them, but don't assert your supremacy over others like this... it just causes nothing but anger and hostility. It rubbed me the wrong way and I do not believe I even posted in this thread!

irishmeghan23

also with stem cell research there is something that is called SCNT, or somatic cell nuclear transfer, which is where you transfer the nucleus from a diploidic cell into an egg which has had its nucleus removed and you can created stem cells that way.

nemo2001

not to be rude towards you irishmeghan23, but why comment on a thread - admittedly with a valid point in your opinion - when the principle posters are not very active on the board anymore? It was dead for almost a year before being brought back. Why it was brought back is another matter...

irish68178

It was brought back as a mistake, a poster saw it under the "featured threads" up top and responded. They really should get rid of that...

nemo2001

i know that person admitted to this above...I'm just amazed at the fact people keep posting on this...

ddjones007

I can give a student perspective from a few decades ago, having graduated in 1984. I also have a son who is a sophomore there.

I was a born-and-bred Catholic who settled into agnosicism, bordering on atheism, when I was a student there. I returned to Catholicism when my first child was born--childbirth has a way of rekindling religious faith!

There is no doubt that Notre Dame is a very Catholic university, as signs of it abound. Roughly half the students come from Catholic high schools, as both my son and I did. That being said, Catholics are a little more close-to-the-belt and low key with their faith than, say, some fundamentalist Christians might be. There was never any pressure to go to Mass, and I seldom did. From what my son tells me, it's pretty much the same up there these days. The opportunities are everywhere, but no one is pushing it down your throat.

If you are concerned about being ostracized for your Judaism or feeling pressured to be something you are not, I never saw that happen up there, nor has my son. If, however, you feel uncomfortable with that which isn't purely secular, you might not find it a good fit. Chances are, if you are the kind of person who has managed to march to your own drummer quite comfortably where you are right now, as I marched to mine, you will find enough like-minded people to feel at home.

Funny thing is, I seldom went to mass there--don't know that I did at all the last few years--and yet the place is built for reflection and soul-searching, of which I did plenty. There is no better place to get in touch with your own soul than walking around those lakes at night...

Wash U is in my home town and my brother attended undergrad there. They are dramatically different campuses, with a different on-campus mindset. If Wash U is your first choice and you are looking for a backup, there are many high quality schools on a par with Notre Dame much more akin to the campus atmosphere--Northwestern and U of Chicago come immediately to mind.

I personally think the place is awesome and still return nearly every summer to walk the lakes when it is quiet and peaceful. It isn't, however, for everyone. I remember too well the kids who chose Notre Dame more for the name than the experience--they were the ones who were dreadfully unhappy and left after the first year.

Hope this helps...