| Barnard or WashU?
I graduated from WashU in 2002 and my wife graduated from Barnard in 2003 so I am pretty familiar with both schools.
If you asked my wife, *she* would say WashU. That being said, she liked NYC (and I did too as I lived there with her during her last year as an undergrad) and she liked her classes which were mainly at Columbia. She wasn't a big fan of many of what she saw as the pseudo-liberal, pseudo-intellectual "Barnard Women"... She liked Barnard when she first visited, and I know that there were some nice people there, but I can see where she was coming from with that opinion. Of course I think she was emotionally scarred by the fact that said Barnard Women would force her out of the common TV room in the dorms because she wanted to watch The Simpsons while everyone there was obsessed with Sex & the City and Dawson's Creek. All that being said, she did do well at the school, so she can't regret everything about it.
I really enjoyed WashU, but I was only an average student there. I thought it was fairly laid back, and the students were mainly midwestern and nice. Of course I think they were nice because I too am from the midwest... On the other hand, there were many students there from the east and west coasts (many from Maryland in fact). There were many competitive students, and more intellectual students than at any given 'average' school.
I can give you my advice, but you probably won't find it helpful. In what follows I will make some pretty big generalizations based on my experience. My wife and I are now both grad students at respectable PhD programs in the humanities (we'll be rich! hahaha right)- maybe that fact might indicate something about my personal biases regarding post-secondary education in general...
I would avoid going to either school if it were up to me. That is hard for me to say, because I really liked WashU, but an undergrad degree from either school isn't really worth the money unless you are (1) very intellectual and certain that you will work VERY hard- harder than 95% of the students there to get the most out of your education, or (2) very ambitious and exceptionally smart about picking a field of study and applying it to some future career in order to make money. As for point 1, for every undergrad student who falls in this class, there are at least a hundred that don't (to the shock of the few who do go to college for the purposes of intellectual stimulation). As for (2) there are more people at these schools (and all the big private schools) that fall into this category, and many of these go into professional/practical fields. There are also many more who THINK they are ambitious and will be smart about their career choice, but really don't have a clue.
These comments are obviously fairly general and apply I think to HYPSM and other "fancy" private schools as well. You do get your money's worth in the sense that your tuition doesn't cover the cost to the school of educating you, but from a personal perspective I don't think one can really justify the personal costs unless your parents are incredibly wealthy or you are exceptional in the way I have described above. I wouldn't recommend taking out loans for undergrad either unless you are in a situation where you must. This applies to both you and/or your parents.
Really, what kind of experience you want out of college does matter in chosing one. But what you at least THINK you want to do after college is very important. If you want to go to graduate school, you can go to a good state school (even just a reasonably okay one) for undergrad and accomplish that task for about a third of the money. Why are your parents paying all those taxes? Plus, if you can get into schools like WashU or Barnard, you could probably get a decent scholarship from a lower state school, though of course such things aren't certain.
The whole idea that you will be in some elite class because you will go to some elite school is only true insofar as you will be going to school mostly with the children of a wealthier class. That being said, the best professors are at the best schools, but even that is dependent upon what specific field we are talking about. There is a wealth of intelligent professors in this country, and as a result most accredited universities have their share. This doesn't mean that all of them (or even remotely most of them) are that great of teachers... If you are motivated, you could do well at UMBC as well as Barnard, although you might like the climate at the latter school better. But is it worth the extra 80-100 grand? I fear that the concepts of 'college-life' and the college experience are oversold in our culture.
The reality is that you need to seriously think about what you really want to do. It is amazing how many young adults (and their parents) are willing to pay so much for something just because "it's part of growing up" or "it will be a time to find yourself" or whatever other reason. Sure, you don't want to just go to college to do work, and you don't want to just go to party, you want some kind of experience. But great experiences can be successfully had for way less than the cost of a private school education. If you can get your state to finance your education, why wouldn't you?
Sorry to ramble on about all of this, I am barely far enough away from any of it to possess any valid opinion about it...
Last edited by aneurysm; 05-20-2005 at 04:10 AM.
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That was the exact decision that I was struggling with in April. I personally chose to go to Barnard. Before visiting, I fully expected to go to Wash U, but after I made my two visits, I knew Barnard was the right choice. The campus at Wash U felt a little too impersonal and spread out for me; it seemed that students stuck to their cliches (sp?), and didn't really socialize with each other. Also, while St. Louis was very nice, it doesn't compare to NYC in terms of being a city. All in all, Barnard just seemed to offer more personal attention, and the girls were more my kind of people. In terms of the students, both Barnard and Wash U students were incredibly smart and motivated, but it did scare me off slightly when my hostess at Wash U said that you could either get good grades (for pre-med) or have a social life, but not both. I'm not trying to diss Wash U in anyway, and it is an incredibly good school that I'm sure I could have been really happy at. But all in all, Barnard was simply a better fit, so thats the biggest thing that you should take in consideration when making your decision. Like lauraemma said, it all comes down to what you want out of your college. Congrats on getting in off the waitlist!
