Janerdoo

Hey,

Though very excited to be an Early Write, i am a bit torn. In december, i was admitted to Yale through its early action program and now I am trying to decide between these two amazing schools.

Feeling pretty overwhelmed. Any advice? Any insight that current Williams students could give me? I'd appreciate it.

Thanks,
Janet

sunkist184

This might seem kind of cheesy, but I think you should make a pros and cons list about each school. For the points that are very important to you, draw a star next to it. In the end, it depends what you are looking for in a school. If you can, visit both. Also, read their profiles in 351 Best Colleges by Princeton Review and the Fiske Guide. I won't guarantee that this will help, but it can't hurt to try.

haon

Some quick differences:

-Williams is smaller (Yale is about 2.5x larger)
-Yale is a university rather than a college (which means you'll have some classes taught by TAs, and larger classes in general)
-Yale is in New Haven while Williams is in the Berkshires.

Janerdoo

hey,

thanks for the feedback.
hmm, i'm pretty aware of the physical differences between yale and williams.
i guess what i'm really looking for is an insider's perspective -- about the social ambience, how yale's undergraduate focus measures up to william's, distinct (+)s offered by williams as opposed to yale, etc.

Also, could anyone tell me about the music environment at williams? i indicated on my application that music was a critical part of my life, and i wasn't kidding.

driver

They both have very fine music departments, although Williams may have the edge in performance studies as opposed to theory/composition. It seems to me that the constant strikes by Yale employees must get to be a drag on the ambience after a while. It's hard to imagine a place with more undergraduate focus than Williams, between the much smaller size, and the expanded Oxford-style tutorial program (even sophomores are getting into these now at Williams). Other than that, you have to consider physical environment....lovely rural New England mountain region, vs. New Haven and easier access to big cities.

twink1etwinkle

this isn't going to help you, but i sure i have to choose between the two schools in a few weeks. lol. congrats!

haon

driver--frosh actually frequently take tutorials as well.

For undergraduate music, I would say that Williams has a clear advantage. Music was a very serious part of my college decision as well, and it was one of the aspects that I extensively researched at all of the colleges I considered. Yale has good graduate programs in music, but unfortunately these don't translate to the undergraduate level. From what I've been told, UG musicians at Yale often get overlooked in the department.

Williams on the other hand has fantastic opportunities for the serious or not-so-serious musician. There are two full symphonies, one of which is semi-professional, a jazz band, a wind ensemble, and numerous smaller chamber groups.

What specific type of music are you interested in?

momrath

Janerdoo, My son is a sophomore at Williams. He applied to Williams ED so he was never in your (quite enviable) position of having to choose between Williams and Yale, but among the ivies, Yale and Brown were his favorites. Yale is very, very appealing. After all, it's Yale! Academically both are excellent, but I would give Williams the edge for student-to-professor interaction. My son chose Williams on the strength of the community and the natural beauty of the surroundings. He's been delighted with the kids, the faculty, his courses, the ambience, the dorms, the social scene, the whole experience.

My son is not a musician, but several of his friends are and they reinforce that Williams has a strong commitment to music. (Same goes for biology.)
I direct you to this thread on the Search and Selection Board, especially Mini's comments regarding Williams music department.
Which east-coast small LAC's have great Music departments?

mini

The Williams music department is superb, the performance opportunities vast, and their record in getting folks into good graduate programs, especially in composition, unparalleled (if that's where you're headed). If you have a special interest in opera, or in early music, or in musical theatre, you'd be better off at Yale (and, perhaps, in ethnomusicology, though there are other places - such as Wesleyan - that are better than both of them. for that). On the whole, Yale's undergraduate programs in music can't compete (the Five Colleges definitely can, but that's a whole different story.).

Janerdoo

Wow, all of this information is really helpful! I had no idea Williams was *this* strong in music.

haon -- I'm really interested in classical piano, free improvisation, and composition. I've been working on my performance diploma from the Royal School of Music in london, and it's made me realize how much i love love love music in both performance and academic aspects. How is the piano department at williams? What kind of opportunities are available for classical pianists?

Janerdoo

mini -- i noticed you're from olympia, wa. (i'm from federal way!)

are you currently a student at williams? there doesn't seem to be a lot of students in washington who know about the school..

mini

I'm an alum, class of '71, father of a d. who is a composer and music major, was recruited by, and was admitted to W. but finally chose to go to Smith (where she is extremely happy - and opera, which is one of her major interests, was one that wouldn't be well-served in Billsville.) We kicked the tires hard at lots of the east coast schools, and we've known David Kechley (chair of the music dept.) and his brother Robert (up in Seattle) for years. One of the music halls at Williams is named after old Professor Shainman, who is an old family friend.

Sorry, I don't know the piano people in the Purple Mountains. Have you actually visited Yale and tried to meet with the music people? (you might be in for a rude awakening....)

Janerdoo

really? a rude awakening? is it that bad?
that discourages me... i've always thought yale's undergraduate music program had a great relationship with the graduate School of Music. In fact, what initially clinched my interest in yale were two piano professors who taught there (in the School of Music) -- Claude Frank and Peter Frankl. Both are world-renowned pianists, and I had heard that a few piano undergrad students were given the opportunity to study with them.

with williams, my biggest concern is that the rural-ness limits performance/master class opportunities. for me, it's been difficult to imagine a small school having conservatory-level resources. i hope you can prove me otherwise.

mini

Again, don't take my word for it. Kick the tires. My d. was not a piano student, but a composer. You could hardly do better than Frank and Frankl (unless you went to Bard, but that's another story.) Just make sure you can get what you need.

And, yes, you are likley correct about the limits of what is there at Williams. They do bring outside folks in for masterclasses, but it is no Yale in that department. So if that is really critical (and it could be), Yale could be the better choice.

This is why you just have to check it out for yourself. If you get in, see if Yale can put you in touch with piano students, current and former. Same at Williams. See what you come up with. And report back, so that other folks can take advantage of what you learn.

EiChef

Janet......stay with the Yale crew!!!!!

<3, Chris