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Yale vs. Columbia Legacy

troky0627troky0627 Registered User Posts: 9 New Member
Hi, I'm a 17 year old Puerto Rican overwhelmed lol.

-I have a 4.2... weighted GPA, do not know my UW one.
-I have been in the National Honor Society since the eigth grade.
-My GPA has been ascending since the 9th grade.
-My first SAT score was 1290 (660 Math, 630 Eng). Took it in august and Will take it again.
-I took AP Micro and USH my junior year. I have taken all honor classes since the eight grade apart from that.
-My senior year course load would be considered heavy in my high school: AP Calc AB, AP Spanish, AP US Gov, AP English, Religion, PR History and Physics.
-I am interested in a political science major.
-Attended a Intensive Law and Trial program at Stanford the summer between 9th and 10th grade.
-Have been part of the Model UN club since 8th grad; have been treasurer and VP. Received multiple recognition and plan on attending a meet in UChi next February.
-I have been part of community service clubs and have 70+ hours.
-Was part of a public health internship.
-Law Club president senior year (member since 10th grade) and part of the school newspaper junior and senior year.
-National Hispanic Scholar
-I shadowed a lawyer this summer.

My family is considering an early decision/restictive early action to any of these two ivys. I considered Yale my dream school but I love the idea of Columbia as well. Would it be more advantageous to do restrictive early at Yale and show them I would definitely go there (and apply RD to Columbia) or do early Columbia with the legacy.

Replies to: Yale vs. Columbia Legacy

  • troky0627troky0627 Registered User Posts: 9 New Member
    Puerto Rican girl* and passed both APs with 4s; I am also on the track team and involved in other clubs.


    Oh and lastly, if I took two subject tests but I didn't do so well on them should I include them in the application anyway or not?
  • fivesagesfivesages Registered User Posts: 68 Junior Member
    Assuming both are your dream colleges, and would be happy to go to either one of them, I would choose ED to Columbia. Here are a few reasons: (1) Your SAT score is going to be a challenge for any of the top colleges; (2) EA/SCEA in general doesn't give much of an edge, especially at the Yale level, until and unless you're a strong candidate (and URM); (3) Legacy only helps in the ED cycle.
  • worriestoomuchworriestoomuch Registered User Posts: 88 Junior Member
    I agree with @fivesages that your GPA and SAT scores are very low for both Columbia and Yale. But your guidance counselor knows your history - personal, academic, and extracurricular - relative to your classmates' college admission history, and should be trusted to help you make this decision. If you have time, you should re-take the SAT (or try the ACT instead). Unless you post your subject test scores, it is impossible to advise you to send them (or not). But if they are below 720, you might want to consider re-taking them too. Despite your legacy status at Columbia, it is a very difficult school to gain admission to. Furthermore, despite its outstanding academics, it is not a school which offers much "hand-holding" or support for students who struggle academically or socially. My advice would be to widen your college search to include match and safety schools.
  • gibbygibby Registered User Posts: 10,086 Senior Member
    edited September 8
    My first SAT score was 1290 (660 Math, 630 Eng). Took it in august and Will take it again.

    The previous posters to your thread have been far too generous, so let me take a stab at this:

    According to the College Board Concordance Table (https://collegereadiness.collegeboard.org/pdf/higher-ed-brief-sat-concordance.pdf), your 1290 on the new SAT is equivalent to an 1810 on the old SAT -- a score SO LOW you have NO CHANCE of being accepted to Yale, Columbia or any ivy league school.

    Don't believe me? Please look at this post from Harvard's Golf recruitment page: http://www.gocrimson.com/sports/mgolf/faq
    For our initial evaluation of golf prospects we typically look for individual SAT I & II scores above 700 and/or ACT scores above 33. We would like to see grades above 3.80 (unweighted) on a 4.0 scale or the equivalent while taking a rigorous course load.

    "Above 700" is based on the old SAT. So, if Harvard is asking recruited athletes to have a base score of 2100 on the old SAT (or a 1470 on the new SAT), a non-athletic recruit with LESS than those scores doesn't stand a chance in hell at being accepted (sorry). That's true at Yale and Columbia and every top 20 college. Realistically, your SAT score needs to be 200 points above where it is now to be a competitive applicant for any ivy league or top college. I know that is not easy to hear (nor is it easy to write).

  • rennie17rennie17 Registered User Posts: 16 New Member
    This is a bit off the original question, but I know for a fact that the crew programs at Harvard and Yale have accepted recruits with much lower SAT scores (old SAT score of <1800) than Harvard golf says they want. Looks like the golf coach doesn't have much juice in the recruiting hierarchy at Harvard.
  • tonymomtonymom Registered User Posts: 913 Member
    Sorry but no way someone with below 1800 SAT athletic recruit or not was accepted to Yale and Harvard. AI would not support that.
  • sattutsattut Registered User Posts: 556 Member
    I would apply ED to Columbia rather than Yale, as you should have a better chance at Columbia, but maybe not much at either, and maybe the legacy will help. Generally, your academic level seems like more like about top 50 school, but people do get into Ivies with that sort of records and strong hooks like athletic recruit or connections.
  • rennie17rennie17 Registered User Posts: 16 New Member
    @tonymom--my comment was based on seeing the Naviance data, so, way. I'll grant that this is likely an outlier, however. Kid in question is capable enough academically that they are still a HY student.
  • BKSquaredBKSquared Registered User Posts: 316 Member
    edited September 11
    The minimum AI for any Ivy athlete is 176. Using an online calculator, you can be a 1600 (old Sat) or 1050 (new SAT) with a 3.5 UW GPA and meet the minimum. At an 1800 old SAT with a 3.5UW GPA, the AI is around 189. So, yes it is possible. However, these admits are extremely rare and are likely highly recruited D1 athletes, and usually for revenue sports like football and basketball because there are overall team and all recruited athletes AI requirements.

    As for the OP, if we look at Yale's latest available CDS for the Class of 2020, 18% or less of matriculates scored below 700 by subsection. The total percentage that scored below 700 for every subsection is going to be even lower (the 670 Math kid might easily have 750's in reading and writing). While the EC's are fine, nothing jumps out in terms of activities and awards in the context of all the amazing kids that will also be applying. URM will help (but with a Columbia legacy, you are presumably not disadvantaged SESwise), but even then, I just don't see a legitimate shot unless your SAT scores are at least approaching 1400 or higher, and definitely no chance at ED/EA unless you are a recruited athlete. I wouldn't waste your EA/ED bullet on a single digit admissions rate school, but would choose more of a high match/low reach school for that. You'll get a more realistic gauge of how strong your application really is.
  • HuntHunt Registered User Posts: 26,777 Senior Member
    Well, OP is going to take SAT again. She might also want to try the ACT. OP, with your grades, scores, and achievements, you will have many options at very good schools as long as you make a good list. As a result, I don't think you need to worry too much about "wasting" your early application. I think if I were in your shoes, I'd apply to Columbia ED, and hope that URM+legacy+ED might help you get accepted. If your scores go up significantly, the calculation might be different. (Note: Aren't you required to submit your subject scores to Yale if you submit SAT, or has that changed again?)
  • IxnayBobIxnayBob Registered User Posts: 3,995 Senior Member
    edited September 11
    Hunt wrote:
    Note: Aren't you required to submit your subject scores to Yale if you submit SAT, or has that changed again?)
    No, afaik, you never were, although it was not worded clearly. As I understand it, if you submitted SAT I (i.e., Aptitude) scores, you had to submit all SAT I scores. If you submitted ACT scores, you had to submit all ACT scores. That concludes the mandatory part of the submission. If you wanted to submit SAT II (i.e., Subject Scores), which was encouraged, you could pick and choose among them.

    There was some additional confusion about whether or not SAT I scores taken in iirc, the 8th grade, for Talent Search purposes had to be submitted. I think most moderate opinions were that it wasn't necessary.

    Another wrinkle is the ability to delete ACT scores, but I'm not going there. :)
  • BKSquaredBKSquared Registered User Posts: 316 Member
    Sorry, a 1290 SAT is not going to cut it, URM, legacy and ED considered. I try to be positive and not discouraging. These kids are under a lot of pressure, but we have to be realistic with them. A 1290 is way,way below the 25th percentile. She needs to get her next SAT/ACT at least within shouting distance of the 25th percentile, which is about another 200 SAT points or a 32 ACT. Even then it's a reach (but a legit shot) as you compete with 10,000+ students with equal or better stats. Sure, if you want to try to win the super mega-lottery in the EA round, go for it. However, you will have foregone the realistic opportunity to have gotten into a good school before the RD deadlines and cutting down on the number schools you have to apply to.

    SAT2's are "recommended", not required for Yale.
  • HuntHunt Registered User Posts: 26,777 Senior Member
    Yale's admissions page now makes it clear that Yale allows Score Choice for SAT subject tests, but not for the SAT test itself. See https://admissions.yale.edu/standardized-testing
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