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official visits and related questions

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Replies to: official visits and related questions

  • MereMomMereMom Registered User Posts: 678 Member
    Nothing is final till the NLI is signed and sent (or the D3 equivalent process is complete). I can't tell you how many coaches made promises or inferred help that didn't come to fruition.
  • fishymomfishymom Registered User Posts: 1,849 Senior Member
    That's fine, if you don't trust the coach's word, then don't commit. I just don't understand the point in commiting to a school and continuing in the recruiting process with other schools. If you want to keep shopping schools, don't commit. If we as a community, athletes/parents/coaches, want a commitment in the recruiting process to mean anything, then we all have to play the game with integrity. Just my opinion, your milage may vary.
  • MereMomMereMom Registered User Posts: 678 Member
    I think the word "commit" is probably inappropriately used here.

    I don't think you can officially commit until the signing period, until then it is just verbal. Coaches change their minds all the time and at the last minute, rescinding their intent to sign an athlete.

    Your verbal intent to commit is no more binding than the coaches until the signing period.
  • mayhewmayhew Registered User Posts: 643 Member
    fishymom, I understand what you are saying regarding "committing" to a school. However, with regards to Ivies, the coach's word can only mean so much. It all comes down to admissions. It is my feeling that the coach can submit your name to admissions, intend to give you a slot, etc. - yet, even if you are a top recruit, there is NO guarantee of anything until you receive that LL from admissions. Yes, you only say "yes!" to a LL from one school, but until you are holding that letter in your hand, it is not a firm agreement. If, for example, my daughter's first OV proves itself to be the ideal fit for her, & she and the coach agree that she will accept a LL from that school, she will continue to go on her OVs until she has the actual LL from the first school in her hand. Obviously, she will not commit to anything at any other school she visits. We are assuming nothing.

    My daughter has 5 officials planned, 4 with ivies, and 1 with a non-ivy academic/athletic equivalent. She is definitely hoping to drop one or two of these OVs due to keeping up with school work, etc. this autumn. All of these OV invitations were made by early July. However, she is still receiving some OV invitations from some schools who she had been communicating with, both ivy and non-ivy, which is a good example of how long the invitation process can be - she received her first one from an ivy in late April, and her most recent one was made by an ivy this past week. A long time margin....! Funnily enough, the schools most competitive in this sport made the OVs significantly earlier than the schools that don't rank as high in this sport.

    Author is also right: the coaches have grapevines - we do feel it is important to be transparent and play it "straight" - we assume that you really can't sneak around on OVs! My daughter will be very open about where she is visiting and what her feelings/opinions/experiences were.
  • Tspwt5Tspwt5 Registered User Posts: 30 Junior Member
    In our experience the Ivy schools have not functioned in the way mentioned in Mayhew's response. Three Ivy coaches asked for official transcripts and score reports for admission reads before talking further with my son. In other words, the coaches made sure he was admissible first. Now he is waiting, and I hope he is not sweating this out for so long due to prospects that may commit to one school while still courting others. Some schools have lost interest in him as he has waited for his top three choices to
    decide about him.








    I'm sorry if you have experienced dishonest coaches.
  • mayhewmayhew Registered User Posts: 643 Member
    ^^Tspwt5: I am so sorry if I gave the impression that we have experienced dishonest coaches! That has not been our experience at all!! We feel that we have consistently had constructive communication, professional behavior, etc.

    Yes, our experience is like yours in that all the schools my daughter may visit has official transcripts, score reports, etc. It only makes sense that they would not offer an OV to someone they don't think they can get through admissions. Indeed, one of these ivies asked my daughter to take her first SAT in the autumn of her Junior year just to make sure that she was someone they could actively recruit in terms of her SAT scores at least. That proved to be very helpful with every school, as her recruiting process started being active last October.

    We are just in a cautious mode, and feel it is best for us not to assume anything or to imagine that everything will go just as I and my daughter might hope...All of the attention is very flattering, etc. but it is not real to us until she has a LL/NLI. The ivy coach may say "yes, we want you, and admissions has seen your transcript and feels OK with it", and that is awesome, but it is not a "done deal" until you actually receive that LL. With non-ivy schools, we feel a bit more relaxed about that. At this time though, all of the coaches are happy, breezy, confident, not sending any vibe of uneasiness with this process with my daughter, but they are not the ones who have their immediate future on the line. My daughter has been really fortunate to have been considered a top recruit in her sport, yet at the same time, we know that everyone is replaceable, and this can be a fickle process. Not a fun thought, but true!

    Again, I cannot empathize enough that we have not had any negative coach experiences/any dishonesty shown towards us! I am really sorry if you had that impression from my post!
  • 3xboys3xboys Registered User Posts: 319 Member
    Tspwt5, an OV invitation does NOT mean an athlete is a shoe-in for admission. A friend of my son's was invited on multiple OVs at Ivies and, in the end, did not get into a single one.
  • MereMomMereMom Registered User Posts: 678 Member
    A friend of DD's received an OV invitation from the D1 top tier school she wanted to go to most (had been accepted by school, coach had assured her she was his top choice and would be receiving NLI, she "committed" to signing with the team during signing period).

    THE DAY BEFORE she was to board the plane, the coach called and cancelled the visit (and the tickets) because an athlete he had wanted more agreed to come for an OV.

    Poor girl was heartbroken and had to scramble to re-open negotiations with her #2, #3, #4 and #5 choice schools (had told coaches she preferred and would commit to school #1). Coaches were understanding, but #2, #3 and #4 didn't sign her either. She ended up at her #5 choice, thankfully as a signed athlete.

    You have to treat this process like a business deal - it is not final till the contracts are signed. Each side is acting in it's own self-interest, and an athlete can just as easily rescind a verbal commitment if their dream school's coach calls out of the blue, as the coach can rescind his offer to you if their dream athlete unexpectedly expresses interest.
  • mayhewmayhew Registered User Posts: 643 Member
    3xboys & Meremom - Thank you - that is my exact point/concern.
  • wilberry228wilberry228 Registered User Posts: 396 Member
    MereMom, that is a terrible story! I hope the girl is happy where she is. Things do happen for a reason, we have to believe!

    One of the coaches basically told my daughter she was a top pick. But he also flat out told her, if someone else comes along who is faster, guess who becomes his top recruit? I actually really liked that guy!
  • authorauthor Registered User Posts: 336 Member
    mere mom typed:
    "You have to treat this process like a business deal - it is not final till the contracts are signed. Each side is acting in it's own self-interest, and an athlete can just as easily rescind a verbal commitment if their dream school's coach calls out of the blue, as the coach can rescind his offer to you if their dream athlete unexpectedly expresses interest. "

    Coaches let down their families when they lose their jobs. Recruiting is their life line to wins = they get to keep their job with winning programs.

    What do you think their choice is going to be?

    They are putting their families lives and all the families of their assistant coaches and staff on their recruit choices.

    You have to sell: I'm the top dog recruit!!!

    IF you want the scholly or a coach to work their magic, for you to be on their team, the sale, as meremom said, is never closed, until on paper.

    While most coaches do every thing in their power, to not burn bridges on a OV or a verbal committment... (why would they hurt their program or relationships with high school/AAu coaches or public relations).
    There are ALWAYS players on their board or in the wings.

    Players sometimes are misinformed and believe they have "committed", when there really wasn't a "committable offer" by the coaching staff.
    We can often get coaches nodding in agreement when we say we are wanting to commit to their program however nods do not make an offer = "committment".

    wilberry:
    our recruits can be labeled top gun, however our recruits, still have to show up. make the team... win a starting position.... keep grades up to be compliant ...all the time knowing/seeing the whole new crop of next year's top guns after their positions.

    Enjoy the process!
  • wilberry228wilberry228 Registered User Posts: 396 Member
    author wrote:

    "our recruits can be labeled top gun, however our recruits, still have to show up. make the team... win a starting position.... keep grades up to be compliant ...all the time knowing/seeing the whole new crop of next year's top guns after their positions."

    This is alarming. Of course, in a sport based on times, this is slightly different, but when an athlete has only ever been with one team since the age of 8, who knows how a different practice schedule/regimen will affect performance? For better or for worse?

    Brings to mind the saying, always someone faster, richer, and better-looking !!

    Buckling in for the ride, and wishing I could slow down time!!
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