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Christian Colleges like Grove City?

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Replies to: Christian Colleges like Grove City?

  • phear_mephear_me Registered User Posts: 291 Junior Member
    Creekland:

    You might consider the Torrey Honors Program at Biola. Based on our previous conversations, this would be an excellent match for your son.

    Torrey Honors Institute Biola University
  • CreeklandCreekland Registered User Posts: 3,858 Senior Member
    At first I too wanted to go too a reasonably conservative school, but have since changed my mind because I want to be challenged more socially (I think in a Conservativish Christian school I would fit in almost too well).

    Actually, our son wants a school where he fits in well as he feels it will give him a better education along the lines of what he wants to do. As parents, we weren't sure at first, but upon visiting secular schools we are certain he is correct. The mindset is close to 100% different.

    He already deals (and has dealt) with mostly liberal teachers and wants to fit in for a change. Perhaps if he were attending a Christian private school we'd feel differently, but that's not our case - and this is major/job plans specific.
  • CreeklandCreekland Registered User Posts: 3,858 Senior Member
    You might consider the Torrey Honors Program at Biola. Based on our previous conversations, this would be an excellent match for your son.

    Were it not in CA, it might be something we'd consider, but it's too far for us to want to travel when there are reasonable options closer. Thanks for the suggestion though.

    Union U (TN) actually seems reasonably decent along both our belief lines and sounds promising academically. They don't have his major directly, but they'll replace Harding as an option for us. Checking out Wheaton, Union, and Covenant could be a reasonable loop trip to do in Oct.

    Since I've ended up hijacking this thread, I'll start another if anyone has Union thoughts they'd care to share.
  • Whistle PigWhistle Pig - Posts: 4,093 Senior Member
    All fine Christian schools with grossly disparate student bodies and academic reputations, if that's important.
  • CreeklandCreekland Registered User Posts: 3,858 Senior Member
    All fine Christian schools with grossly disparate student bodies and academic reputations, if that's important.

    It probably does matter - but I'm too new to Christian colleges to know the difference (other than stats). There's a reason I found this board. I don't aim to be one offering advice, I'm a searcher. We're looking for schools in the Eastern half of the US that offer Community/Economic/Global Development with decent academics and that reasonably fit in with our beliefs (profs as I understand there is often a wide diversity among students). Then finances will come into play. His preference is south. He was born in FL and never really adapted to PA winters.

    So far we've only found Eastern (PA) and Covenant (GA) that have his major directly. Eastern has been eliminated due to low SAT stats (mid 50% 470/600CR, 450/580M).

    Covenant actually impressed me more than I thought a small school could when we visited, but it is definitely small with few bells and whistles. It appears to have a really good academic reputation locally - and ranks fairly high with both Forbes and USNWR (for its category). We liked the head of the Dept and fully agree with his recent book (which we read). People within my son's intended major like the school. However, it seems to be having issues lately within its own denomination as a few people have warned me to check out their Bible classes. They are Calvinist, we are not. Their change might be a plus to us, BUT attendance has been an issue with them dropping 1/5th of their student population in the last couple of years. By alienating their base, they might truly have issues and we wonder if they will be able to stay in business... So, we have them in mind, but will keep abreast of their 'issues' and have other options lined up. SAT 520/650CR, 510/620M - not great - but not as low as Eastern, and potentially setting up nicely for merit aid.

    Wheaton does not have the major my son wants, but offers a certificate that can be earned and sort of similar classes in the field - not as extensive. It has a good name for itself, but with some minor cautions within the field (by those working there) that it might be getting too elite - esp for this job type. That has to be considered when you hear it from potential employers. Nonetheless, it's just a caution and not a red flag. I love the fact that it is non-denominational and has high academic standards. We have yet to visit to know how we feel when there. Proximity to Chicago is a negative as is the climate overall. SAT 600/700CR, 610/690M is ideal, but it doesn't set up well for aid as my son is only in the top 25% for math, nor is Wheaton well-known for meeting aid - hence, this school is probably too expensive for what he wants to do. Adding it to our travels is almost more out of curiosity, but we might try an application anyway. We'll know after we see it.

    Union (TN) was the latest suggestion I had received. They do not have the major at all, but have a bit of 'mission' activity going on and seem incredibly friendly and interested in us. Their Biblical views probably most closely match ours if it's true that they aren't legalistic. If this is the school of choice, it would have to be a Business or Economics major coupled with Intercultural Studies. Like Wheaton, some of the classes sort of match his intended major. It's very similar to Harding in that aspect and SAT scores, but is closer to home and to our beliefs than Harding is. SAT 510/650CR, 510/640M, again, potentially setting us up well for Merit Aid. Unlike Covenant, Union appears to be on the rise both in attendance and within rankings. They are actively trying to increase in the rankings, but I suppose that's true of most colleges. They should have more bells and whistles in the college itself since it's larger. We'll know more when we visit.

    That's the gist of my internet searching and talking with a few contacts - following up on suggestions. We're definitely open to more ideas or thoughts from anyone - pro or con. Application season has not ended yet.

    If you're curious... I do think GCC will be out for us - combo of northern climate, not having his major directly, and stats that show students graduating from there tend to have the most debt compared to our other choices. There should be no need for him to apply to umpteen colleges - just decent ones he's interested in to see what financial aid is offered coupled with programs.
  • phear_mephear_me Registered User Posts: 291 Junior Member
    Why are you so intent on keeping him close to home?

    If you want the best academic, non-competitive atmosphere the Torrey program at Biola blows everyone away (Average GPA= 4.0 and average core SAT = just under 1400). Minimums for that program are 3.8 and 1800 combined SAT (MINIMUMS). There isn't a Christian university in the nation that can come close to that. It's everything you want for your son, but you're insisting on keeping him back east.

    Why?
  • susgeeksusgeek Registered User Posts: 1,603 Senior Member
    I am not who you are addressing, but I also am keeping my kids "close" to home (in the North East).

    It is a logistical issue - I also would be unable to visit and send a kid to California, or more than 8 or so hours drive away.
  • phear_mephear_me Registered User Posts: 291 Junior Member
    sus,

    Your children adults going away to college - maybe it's time to cut the umbilical cord.

    As an aside, your "need" to see them is selfish and could, potentially, be hindering their development into autonomous, independent, self sustaining individuals. Christian parents usually do a fantastic job from birth to age 18 and then completely screw the pooch on preparing their children to face the world as adults, leaving this country with a generation of believers who are naive, sophomoric, and overly dependent. A parent's job is to prepare their children to be able to handle anything, on their own, at their point of maturity. At no time in this process are the parent's feelings important. What matters is the development of that child. This is the part where all those great skills you've taught them need to be put to use. Guilting them into staying close so YOU can see them is like teaching someone to be a professional cyclist but never taking off their training wheels because you're afraid they might ride too far away and leave you all alone. Evern worse is if the don't want to take the training wheels off too - it all seems so justified right? They WANT to stay! And yet, your job is to make them the best cyclers (people) you can and that can't happen with training wheels (an over dependence on their parents). In this situation, everything often seems great, until that first day of real competition when they have to take off the training wheels, and they come in last place. That is, if they even enter the race at all.

    Don't let your selfish and waning emotional needs keep your children from going to the right college. If it happens to be close, so be it. But limiting them to a geographical area that fits YOUR needs for travel implies a view on the parent/child relationship that is patently unhealthy.
  • susgeeksusgeek Registered User Posts: 1,603 Senior Member
    There is no umbilical cord involved - it is all about money, which we don't have a lot as it is.

    My three college age children (one in grad school, two undergrads) are only in college due to a tremendous amount of financial aid. There is no way I could handle the cost of air travel, particularly moving furniture, etc., cross country. We have a total of seven children and it would be unfair to devote an inordinate amount of financial assistance to one unnecessarily - particularly when there are plenty of choices within 500 miles (hardly an umbilical cord).

    Only someone who doesn't balance a checkbook and pay the bills at the end of every month would see financial prudence as an inability to cut the umbilical cord. Emotions are not involved - it is limited cold hard cash.
  • phear_mephear_me Registered User Posts: 291 Junior Member
    Maybe your kids don't need brand new furniture and can simply take a bus? Most schools have dorms that come furnished. Just sounds like a very convenient excuse to me - especially if you have limited funds - which would make me think you'd look in a wider area in the pursuit of scholarships etc.

    I still think it has more to do with the cost of YOU going out to see them and not the cost of moving them into college.

    But hey, that's just my 2 cents and an assumption I'm making over an internet message forum. It's something to think about, and if it doesn't apply, good.
  • susgeeksusgeek Registered User Posts: 1,603 Senior Member
    My youngest daughter doesn't live in a dorm, nor does my eldest. They both live in apartments. Younger daughter has a scholarship which gives her free tuition. Elder daughter is in grad school and borrowing her tuition.

    My son is in a "dorm" but it is actually more like an apartment. It had very limited furniture.

    Since close to half of the colleges in the US are within driving distance of our house, the kids never complained about that restriction. They are very independent.

    Perhaps you DO need to be more careful with your assumptions.
  • phear_mephear_me Registered User Posts: 291 Junior Member
    Just because your other children live in unfurnished apartments doesn't mean this one has to. That's absurd, and you know it.

    There is no place in the country where "half the colleges" are within driving distance, unless you take driving distance to mean more than 8 hours.

    I am perfectly careful with my assumptions, clearly pointing them out.

    Nothing you said actually engages the point I was making, which makes it fairly obvious how much it does, or doesn't, apply to you.

    Best of luck.
  • CreeklandCreekland Registered User Posts: 3,858 Senior Member
    Why are you so intent on keeping him close to home?

    If you want the best academic, non-competitive atmosphere the Torrey program at Biola blows everyone away (Average GPA= 4.0 and average core SAT = just under 1400). Minimums for that program are 3.8 and 1800 combined SAT (MINIMUMS). There isn't a Christian university in the nation that can come close to that. It's everything you want for your son, but you're insisting on keeping him back east.

    Why?

    Simple. I don't feel Biola has anything more than he can get in the colleges closer to us. YOU might consider them the best - but no one else I've talked to (in his field) does. (Eastern also has an honors program he could be in where the minimum SAT is 1400 CR/M if we wanted that -we don't.)

    I feel no need for him to travel more than a day's drive away when he can get what he needs closer. Financial issues do come into play for us right now, but even if they didn't, it wouldn't change our views. Neither of us particularly like CA - esp Los Angeles and vicinity (yes, we've been there). CA's national parks are nice, but he's not going to college to be closer to nice NP's.

    For a son who's been traveling out of country since he was 13 (without relatives) - I don't think umbilical cords nor a lack of preparation to see or live in the real world applies. He plans to work in Central America at this point - with our blessings.

    You are entitled to your views, but you have to realize, a good portion of us disagree with them. You are money hungry. We are not. You are prestige hungry. We are not. You obviously don't care all that much about physically seeing family and keeping a reasonable relationship together. We do. You and I are probably about as far apart in values as one can get.

    IF my son were to want to go to CA to a school, I'd consider it. He has emphatically said he does not. If he couldn't find what he wanted outside of Western schools, we'd consider them. That's not an issue either. If someone we respected in his field told us the best choice was XYZ, we'd consider it. They haven't.

    To each our own.
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