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Five Biggest Trends in College Admissions

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Replies to: Five Biggest Trends in College Admissions

  • ucbalumnusucbalumnus Registered User Posts: 62,870 Senior Member
    edited September 1
    doschicos wrote:
    How would the student not get credit if their transcript indicates they took a more advanced level of a course and accomplished greater mastery of the subject vs a more basic level?

    Colleges are less likely to allow credit or advanced placement for a purely high school calculus (or other) course without external validation (AP score or college credit through a dual enrollment arrangement).

    Now, if a high school calculus teacher were to cover the AP calculus material in greater depth, while still having students fully prepared for the AP test (and encouraging the students to take it), and not bothering to pay the CB for the AP name or whatever for the course, that is certainly possible. But that is not the same as completely abandoning AP calculus.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,664 Senior Member
    Taking a look at a sample transcript, http://www.mastery.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/Transcript-example_v4.png, maybe three areas out of eight correspond to mastery of traditional academic subjects. If you think there's too much regurgitation on AP tests, the solution isn't to replace it with a completely subjective process, where the teacher or guidance counselor evaluates students on personality traits and buzzword gibberish like flexibility.
  • BuckeyeMWDSGBuckeyeMWDSG Registered User Posts: 444 Member
    In Ohio - The combination of transferable credits and their guidelines https://www.ohiohighered.org/transfer coupled with the high school's ability to partner with institutions of higher learning to provide access to college credit courses on site https://www.ohiohighered.org/content/college_credit_plus_info_students_families has the effect of turning every public hs in Ohio into a location to access college classes. Because the hs is responsible for providing up to 120 semester credits per student a cost control strategy becomes negotiating with higher ed institutions to pay by class for instruction on site and urge students to schedule provided classes. We are moving toward "colleges at a public high school without the AP framework" for providing rigor and these classes are being offered onsite at both small and large public high schools. While intended to curb costs, the access allows younger students to participate and many complete their hs diploma requirements in 3 years, leaving the traditionally senior year of high school to take place entirely on a campus usually in sophomore level classes.

    Kids see they don't have to wake up at 6 in the morning to be at hs senior year and are very motivated by that freedom.
  • Mom2aphysicsgeekMom2aphysicsgeek Registered User Posts: 3,720 Senior Member
    AoPS is a good example of teaching more advanced content without following AP guidelines. My d's took AoPS cal, did not have AP on his transcript, but he easily scored a 5 on BC.
  • shuttlebusshuttlebus Registered User Posts: 156 Junior Member
    The College Board does not charge a fee for using the AP designation on a course. As a homeschooler, I have submitted a number of my syllabi to the College Board for approval to use the AP designation and have never been charged a fee.
  • ucbalumnusucbalumnus Registered User Posts: 62,870 Senior Member
    turtle17 wrote:
    So I'm not a high school teacher, but I know our HS reasonably well, and I don't see the evidence of huge $$ for APs. Are the extra $$ being discussed the test fees? I am unaware of any $$ beyond that. I'd guess for calculus, the hardest part is finding HS math teachers comfortable teaching it.

    There is an AP Course Audit process that a high school must go through to label the course as an AP course on the transcript. However, a high school may still offer AP exams regardless of whether the related course has been through the AP Course Audit.

    It is possible for a high school to offer courses that cover the material tested in the AP exams without going through the AP Course Audit process, and not calling those courses AP courses (even if they cover the same material at similar or greater rigor). However, that is different from just disregarding any consideration of AP material or exams altogether. Indeed, it would not be surprising if some of the more elite high schools that do not want to offer AP courses simply dropped out of the AP Course Audit process but still have courses that include the material that students need to succeed on the AP exams.
  • turtle17turtle17 Registered User Posts: 97 Junior Member
    I'm fine with any of the ways discussed to show reasonable master of the material - AP test without AP "course", advanced course that covers material and more with AP test, test offered by university, the Ohio system with HS connected to university, gosh knows what else.
    But I'm completely with roethlisburger in post #62.
  • Ufotofu9Ufotofu9 Registered User Posts: 2 New Member
    edited September 10
    I have never heard a single top school who expects applicants to take as many AP's as they can. That is simply a lie

    You can't possibly know that's a lie. It may be untrue, but a lie is an intentional false statement. You don't know that the author intentionally made a false statement. I

    I'm sorry, but the overuse of the word "lie" a a huge pet peeve of mine.

    In my HS there were three academic tracks:
    Modified - For below average students
    Academic - For average students
    Honors/AP - Above average students

    Obviously the grade were weighted differently towards your GPA. For a example, and A in an Honors/AP course would be a 4.0 while an A in an Academic level course would be a 3.5 and in General an a might be a 3.0. But there was no distinction between the an Honors course and an AP course. AP Chemistry, for example, was the highest level chemistry offered, and the only way to get a 4.0 in Chemistry.

    I don't know if other schools operate similarly, but I suspect they do. Which means that AP courses would by definition be required to gain admission to a selective college.
  • exlibris97exlibris97 Registered User Posts: 755 Member
    @Ufotofu9 AP courses are important but having worked in admissions at any Ivy, I can state emphatically that it isn't necessarily true that it is better to have a 3.6 in AP courses as opposed to a 4.0 in regular or honors ones. This is especially true if you go to a highly regarded school. Those "As" do matter.
  • exlibris97exlibris97 Registered User Posts: 755 Member
    edited September 12
    @doschicos I cannot speak for all universities, but when I worked in admissions we reviewed applications electronically. The admissions clerks entered the information we saw. At my particular college, under transcripts there was a notation of "school reported cumulative GPA" and two-year GPA (junior and senior). There was also a 'flag' that indicated whether the school weighted grades. We didn't see the actual transcript albeit we could request it (I can never recall doing so). It worked the same way with SAT scores, the clerks updating the system to reflect the highest scores earned.

    I think some people think that admissions counsellors still get 'folders' to read or see the actual Common App. This may be the case at some universities, but it wasn't at ours. Indeed, the only time I can remember entire applications being downloaded and printed was when some discrepancy was noted and the application was being more closely reviewed.
  • doschicosdoschicos Registered User Posts: 14,415 Senior Member
    @exlibris97 So, I'm curious as to what your school does when they receive a transcript without a GPA or even a traditional grading system? Such schools do exist. I'm sure there are no longer paper folders as apps are submitted electronically but the application "package" (grades, essays, recommendations) are still considered, just electronically now. No need to print. Just like we read news online, pay bills online, etc. I suppose.
  • ucbalumnusucbalumnus Registered User Posts: 62,870 Senior Member
    exlibris97 wrote:
    I cannot speak for all universities, but when I worked in admissions we reviewed applications electronically. The admissions clerks entered the information we saw. At my particular college, under transcripts there was a notation of "school reported cumulative GPA" and two-year GPA (junior and senior). There was also a 'flag' that indicated whether the school weighted grades. We didn't see the actual transcript albeit we could request it (I can never recall doing so). It worked the same way with SAT scores, the clerks updating the system to reflect the highest scores earned.

    How do you know whether the "school reported cumulative GPA" is based on an exaggerated weighting system, like the ones that can result in 6.something GPAs? A 4.3 weighted GPA could mean a 4.0 unweighted GPA, or a 2.9 unweighted GPA, depending on the weighting system.
  • NCSwimmomNCSwimmom Registered User Posts: 80 Junior Member
    @exlibris97 Did you work at a large state university with large numbers of applicants or a smaller private college? I work for a large university and see more "weeding out" using GPA for various programs and scholarship opportunities than I would like to see. A 4.0 GPA from an underfunded rural public school is very different than a 3.3 GPA from a rigorous urban public, private or boarding school with a tougher grading policy. Students with lower GPA's who tackled a more rigorous curriculum may be better prepared for college work that students who have higher GPA's from other schools.
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