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Feds uncover admissions test cheating plot

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Replies to: Feds uncover admissions test cheating plot

  • lookingforwardlookingforward 34157 replies378 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 14
    Even the restricted (generic development term) donations have the caveat attached. Something like, "...or at the universty's best discretion." They'll adhere to the donor's intention as best they can. But if, say, they drop a sport or no longer have xx major, the U is covered. The donor signs off on this. The checks and balances on development mean they have to use it as specified, as long as feasible.
    edited May 14
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  • northwestynorthwesty 3506 replies9 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 14
    The hockey or lax coach at Yale probably makes $150-200k in salary. Then they make some more by running camps during the off-season. It isn't huge bucks.

    So the income from a $2 million endowment pays for that head coach's salary in perpetutity. Which then frees up $150-200k of annual budget for that team or for the athletic department.

    It really is no different than endowing a chair in the english department. Except for the fact that the english professor doesn't get 3-5 admissions tips like the lax or hockey coach does.
    edited May 14
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  • lookingforwardlookingforward 34157 replies378 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 14
    But if growth is 15% and say, the U allocates 6% to the fund purpose, it might only be 18k/year. Depends on the wording.

    If they sent150k to the dept, it would only last, say, 13 years (you can calculate how growth would extend this a bit.)

    Btw, if you endow a chair, I can still make a contibution to that endowment.

    (I just wish we could turn 15%/year. Many colleges publish growth info online.)
    edited May 14
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  • HannaHanna 14866 replies42 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    "Except all cash is fungible."

    Almost nothing in an endowment fund is fungible.
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  • privatebankerprivatebanker 5273 replies77 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 14
    @1NJParent and @northwesty

    Read my post. Carefully this time please.

    No one said Yale coaches. Or hockey coaches. Especially hockey coaches at Yale.

    Yale is an intercollegiate athletics non factor.

    The quote was roughly “coaches are the highest paid employees at many universities”. You don’t need me to the list the dozens and dozens of examples. The concept being at schools like Stanford Auburn Georgetown Villanova Duke UNC Mich Cal UF UT NU and countless others that choose to compete at the highest intercollegiate level - to have a big pool of money for the coaches and programs - outside of the normal channel and endowment, these resources could be channeled into other important areas.

    Why would that be a controversial idea?

    Sure, get athletics out of colleges. Not happening anytime soon. This at least gets athletics out of the research budgets etc. to some degree.
    edited May 14
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  • twoinanddonetwoinanddone 22990 replies17 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    I don't think Huffman should get prison sentence. If it were any other person caught cheating, there would be a fine and not nearly as much publicity as there is here. If she had just paid someone to take the test or change the computer, it wouldn't have been such a big deal (and I'm one who believes there is a lot of cheating on the tests, with either another person taking the test or some other method).

    I think she will get the $20k fine and a 4 month suspended sentence. And her child will never get to go to college.
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  • privatebankerprivatebanker 5273 replies77 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    @twoinanddone

    Have to disagree with your final point.

    Of course her child can and should be able to go to college.

    There are many auto admit and state unversities that allow for second chances. Heck I recall about some Columbia grads that had previously been incarcerated.

    Actual convicted felons and folks in prison currently obtain college degrees. Some are very serious offenders and get a second chance.

    This kid didn’t even know about the test help.
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  • Nrdsb4Nrdsb4 16947 replies159 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    Maybe her last name is actually Macy and it won't raise as many red flags?

    She'll land somewhere.
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  • KnowsstuffKnowsstuff 4243 replies17 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    I haven't followed this to closely but what is happening to the people that actually took the tests for the students? Any mention of who is these people are or is just like one person? Thx.
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  • PetraMCPetraMC 771 replies5 threadsRegistered User Member
    I think our criminal justice system is far too punitive and quick to put people in jail in general. So I can't say I hope Huffman goes to jail for this. However, I *don't* want her to avoid jail time only because she did a rich white person non-violent crime instead of a poor POC non-violent crime. My former assistant's dad was in jail for months for passing a bad check.

    I think she will likely do a small amount of jail time.
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  • ScipioScipio 8467 replies477 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    Sofia Grace Macy will certainly get to go to college somewhere, assuming that this whole sordid mess hasn't put her off of the idea of college in general.

    Her mother is the one here who is being punished, not Sofia. And it's not at all clear that Sofia knew anything about the wrongdoing. We've seen kids with much blacker marks against their names than that successfully go to college. She'll get in somewhere.
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  • lkg4answerslkg4answers 1643 replies194 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    Did Sofia Macy get accepted and then rescinded? Or did she not get accepted anywhere this year?
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  • lkg4answerslkg4answers 1643 replies194 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    I haven't followed this to closely but what is happening to the people that actually took the tests for the students? Any mention of who is these people are or is just like one person? Thx.

    Google "Mark Riddell"
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  • ScipioScipio 8467 replies477 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    "Did Sofia Macy get accepted and then rescinded? Or did she not get accepted anywhere this year?"


    This point was discussed a few hundred posts upthread, and the general conclusion was that she was not rescinded and in fact did not yet apply to college - apparently taking a gap year. Before this all blew up her dad had publicly stated that he favored a gap year for her.
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  • VickiSoCalVickiSoCal 3381 replies33 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    Sofia's case is pretty straightforward. Retake the SAT under real conditions and most universities would still consider her like a regular applicant.
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  • northwestynorthwesty 3506 replies9 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 15
    "The quote was roughly “coaches are the highest paid employees at many universities”.

    Banker -- I'm not sure what point you are trying to make. Since nothing in this discussion relates to what the Nick Sabans and John Caliparis get paid. But your statement is so misleading as to be inaccurate.

    The accurate statement would be that "the men's basketball head coach and the football head coach are the highest paid employees at many D1 universities."

    That is pretty much never true for any other coaches of any other sports at any colleges.

    Plenty of other university employees make more than the coaches in non-revenue sports -- the university prez, COO, CFO, GC will all make much more than the typical college coach. So does the law school faculty. So does the B-school faculty. So does the med school faculty.

    The relevant point for this discussion is that the non-revenue coaches do not get paid a lot. But they do get admissions tips. Hence the temptation to sell those tips for cash which goes to the sports program or to the coach's pocket.
    edited May 15
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  • epiphanyepiphany 8405 replies170 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    Upthread, a few posts:
    No, Felicity Huffman should not avoid jail "just because" she is a rich white person. Neither should she be punished for being (1) a rich white person; (2) a celebrity.

    There is an excessive amount of Schadenfreude in our culture, but particularly toward celebrities, who sometimes receive more than their share of gleeful hand-rubbing when they do get caught. We can argue and agree that too few rich people, white people, and celebrities even get caught and brought to justice for crimes. However, that does not justify scapegoating those who do get caught. That's a disordered and "generalized" kind of "justice," not much more dignified than physical vigilante justice, which actually operates from a similar principle when you think about it.
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  • PetraMCPetraMC 771 replies5 threadsRegistered User Member
    @epiphany I agree, she should be treated just like anyone else of any income. But unfortunately, too often, that means jail.
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  • privatebankerprivatebanker 5273 replies77 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    edited May 15
    @northwesty. Easy. It’s ok. I agree with you.

    I was commenting to the thread direction at the time, discussing the idea of direct donations to fund athletics.

    Some see as a bad idea. Ok. I’m open to it

    Let the supporters of the sports help fund it directly and not take away money from the core mission.

    And yes at many schools. Dozens and dozens. The highest paid person on staff if a coach or two.

    Yes, not every sport. And not every school.

    What could possibly be misleading about saying “at many” are the highest paid. It’s a fact. And certainly wouldn’t say all and everywhere. That would be misleading.

    Oh FYI. Here’s an article from your school newspaper from a few years ago.

    “Northwestern head football coach Pat Fitzgerald made $2.48 million in 2013, according to Northwestern's 2013 tax return, which was released Tuesday. The document shows salaries for Northwestern's top earning faculty and staff.”

    Plus 2.7mm in loans. Total $5mm+. School president that year made 1.3mm.

    Another local school DePaul paid its basketball coach 2.3mm and the chancellor made 900k.

    That’s just two schools I checked for fun in Chicagoland.
    edited May 15
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  • twoinanddonetwoinanddone 22990 replies17 threadsRegistered User Senior Member
    I don't think any other person who paid someone to cheat on a test, who falsified a resume, who signed a false applcation would go to jail. White, black or green, I don't think our prisons are filled with cheaters of this type. Food stamp fraud for thousands, medicare fraud by a doctor over a period of years? Yes, but not one time cheaters.

    The parent defendants weren't plotting to overtake the education system of the US, they were trying to get one or two kids into college. Singer and the ADs and the test taker were the masterminds, committing the same acts over and over. The parents bought stolen goods, signed a false form, took a deduction on their taxes that will be disallowed.
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