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Hamas Is In Control

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Replies to: Hamas Is In Control

  • ryan2288ryan2288 2380 replies121 threads Senior Member
    The land partitioned by the UN to become the nation of Israel was a majority Jewish. Not a single Muslim was kicked out.

    I guess we all need a history lesson at times. Immigration(most of it illegal) to Palestine by jews started rapidly in the 1920's and hundreds of thousands immigrated to Palestine, again illegally, during the Holocaust. Because of this it created great tensions amongst the illegally immigrated jews and 1.2 million Arabs living in the area. When the UN drew its borders it did so in a way where certain districts with a large minority arab population were in a jewish state. Technically nobody was kicked out, but by differences in faith and ideologies essentially Arabs were booted out. Lets face it, Arabs had claim to all of the palestinian state well before many jews emigrated there from a war torn europe.

    The main reason that Israel even got independence is because of strong Zionist lobbies in the United States(the same reason why Israel gets so many military weapon contracts from the U.S today, ever heard of AIPAC). Arabs have always been treated as second rate by the western world. Its not something to argue about, its a fact.
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  • jpps1jpps1 1908 replies85 threads. Senior Member
    I still don't get why people think Israel has something to gain by killing civilians, as if they have a "secret" agenda that they must hide, since they're a recognized country unlike the Palestinians...

    If they're not terrorists (i.e. not a threat) and killing civilians brings bad publicity, why would Israel target civilians--whether or not that intention is tacit or public? Civilians die in any war--that does not change whether or not that war is justified. But a war that EXPRESSLY targets civilians is not a war--it is terrorism.

    And to the poster above, it is true--land given to Israel under the partition plan did have a majority of Jews on it. The non-Jewish land came from defensive gains after the War of Independence, instigated by the Arab countries. Given the clear hostile nature of its neighbours, Israel felt it necessary to keep that land--without it, Israel would have only been 9-10 miles wide at most points.

    Any territorial war will produce refugees; the War of Independence was no different. Most of the Arabs that were "evicted" were not in Israeli territory mandated by the Partition Plan; however, neighbouring Arab countries refused to take in those refugees.

    Let us not forget Barak's unbelievably generous offer that Arafat rejected--95% of the West Bank, the Gaza Strip, a capital in Jerusalem and $30 billion in reparations for displaced Palestinians. The land offered here was more than enough to accomodate the Palestinian population, and it was land already occupied by many Palestinians. On top of that, the reparations acknowledged wrongdoing in the displacement of Palestinians. The fact that Arafat rejected this offer tells you a lot about the mindset of Palestinians. Their former leader was a terrorist (documented links to Munich and arms shipments to terrorists) and their current government has a stated policy of the EXTERMINATION of the State of Israel, of any Jewish state in the Middle East. By contrast, Israel has offered a state to Palestinians and is ready to coexist.
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  • hmh01hmh01 52 replies9 threads Junior Member
    "I still don't get why people think Israel has something to gain by killing civilians, as if they have a "secret" agenda that they must hide"



    "We have to kill all the Palestinians unless they are resigned to live here as slaves." Chairman Heilbrun of the Committee for the Re-election of General Shlomo Lahat, the mayor of Tel Aviv, October 1983.

    Also Ben Gurion stated " The present map of Palestine was drawn by the British mandate. The Jewish people have another map which our youth and adults should strive to fulfill -- From the Nile to the Euphrates."

    "There was no such thing as Palestinians, they never existed." Golda Maier Israeli Prime Minister June 15, 1969.

    "The only solution is Eretz Israel, or at least Western Eretz Israel (=all the land west of Jordan River), without Arabs. There is no room compromise on this point ... We must not leave a single village, not a single tribe." Joseph Weitz, Director of the Jewish National Fund, the Zionist agency charged with acquiring Palestinian land, Circa 194. Machover Israca, January 5, 1973 p.2.

    "Jewish blood and a goy's (gentile's) blood are not the same." Israeli Rabbi Yitzhak Ginsburg, Inferring that killing isn't murder if the victim is Gentile. Jerusalem Post, June 19,1989.



    "There is no other way than to transfer the Arabs from here (Palestine) to the neighboring countries, to transfer all of them; not one village, not one tribe should be left." Jospeh Weitz, Davar, 29 September 1947 from "My Diary and Letters to the Children", Massada, 1965, III, p. 293.

    "When we have settled the land, all the Arabs will be able to do about it will be to scurry around like drugged cockroaches in a bottle." Raphael Eitan, Chief of Staff of the Israeli Defence Forces, New York Times, 14 April 1983.


    You should read the posts before barging yourself in this thread and starting to post. You should read what has been said and what has been going on.
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  • neverbornneverborn 1831 replies46 threads Senior Member
    Palestinians? There is no country called Palestine. Meir was right. Illegally? According to who's law? Britain had no problem with it.

    hmh01: Google "Jewish blood and a goy's (gentile's) blood are not the same." - I see only pro-Palestinian forums, NO verified sources. Find me one for this and the rest of them.
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    You see hmh, you posted about Israelis saying that they should do wrong.

    I posted about Palestinians doing wrong.

    There is a difference.

    Should I bring up some quotes from Palestinians stating that they wish every Jew was dead? They are much more recent than 1986....
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  • OneThousandFistsOneThousandFists 144 replies2 threads* Junior Member
    I believe Cuse is a moron, and its in the best interest for this discussion to ignore his posts.

    Neverborn, if you believe that I am Nazi, then so be it. Indeed, there's nothing worse than having Jews put in gas chambers ;).
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  • TpeckTpeck 518 replies72 threads- Member
    You guys hear the speech last night?

    USgay: We will defend Israel at all costs.

    Yeah USA is the Jew's B-tch.
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    [qoute]I believe Cuse is a moron, and its in the best interest for this discussion to ignore his posts. [/qoute]

    I would rather be a moron than a terrorist...

    [qoute]USgay[/qoute]

    Who is USgay?
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  • guguruguguru 374 replies33 threads Member
    i think he meant usa and said it usgay.

    "Let us not forget Barak's unbelievably generous offer that Arafat rejected--95% of the West Bank, the Gaza Strip, a capital in Jerusalem and $30 billion in reparations for displaced Palestinians. The land offered here was more than enough to accomodate the Palestinian population, and it was land already occupied by many Palestinians."

    the palestinians were on the land before the jews, they should not have to "accept" an offer on land that is theres, they should have all of it.
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  • OneThousandFistsOneThousandFists 144 replies2 threads* Junior Member
    I would rather be a moron than a terrorist...

    I would rather be a moron than a Zionist.
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    the palestinians were on the land before the jews, they should not have to "accept" an offer on land that is theres, they should have all of it.

    The won't accept an offer, therefore they won't get any more offers. No loss to the Israelis...
    I would rather be a moron than a Zionist.

    Cool. I guess we are both morons then.

    guguru,

    Should the USA cease to exist and give all of its land back to the Native Americans?
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  • guguruguguru 374 replies33 threads Member
    "Should the USA cease to exist and give all of its land back to the Native Americans?"

    Well, if Israeli's can claim that they have ancestors who used to live in Israel and that gives them the right to take Palestine, then the native americans have the right to say that they should take control. Since the american government will never give the remaining native americans all of america back, it is hypocritical of the government and its citizens to support Israel. Why should the palestinians give the land back to people who inhabited it over 1 and a half millenia ago and then moved?
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  • TpeckTpeck 518 replies72 threads- Member
    Bush said he will defend all things Jewish last night. What a ****heel.
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    Since the american government will never give the remaining native americans all of america back, it is hypocritical of the government and its citizens to support Israel.

    Hypocritical? Israel is like a reincarnation of the US. We forced the Native Americans off of their land and will never give it back; the UN when it created Israel forced the Palestinians off of their land and Israel will never give it back. We are one and the same, buddy.

    Plus, the USA could never support the Palestinians simply because they have a serious addiction to blowing up civilians that makes it hard for anyone to support them. Notice how no one is doing anything about that wall Israel is building?
    Bush said he will defend all things Jewish last night.

    Yes he did. As will every President, even if the Dems win in '08. The Democrats have a strong Jewish presence that they are afraid to **** off; hence America will continue to support Israel no matter which party wins.
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  • princessbellprincessbell 1928 replies151 threads Senior Member
    I was in the middle of reading about the power stuggle between the Hamas and Fatah parties, when I left my New Yorker mag in 1st period. It's probably been stolen/thrown away/chewed up by now and I'm really ****ed because I barely got halfway through it. I couldn't figure out though (because it was from an israeli point of view) which party is the "bad" one. In general, i mean, because I know different people have different opinions.
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  • guguruguguru 374 replies33 threads Member
    "Hypocritical? Israel is like a reincarnation of the US. We forced the Native Americans off of their land and will never give it back; the UN when it created Israel forced the Palestinians off of their land and Israel will never give it back. We are one and the same, buddy."

    well, buddy, the native americans have been massacred and more or less wiped out in a genocidal fashion. The palestinians obviouly do not like being "forced...of thier land" and they are mad that "Israel will never give it back" so they are trying to regain it. They have not been completely wiped out, and they are fighting to make sure they wont be.

    "Notice how no one is doing anything about that wall Israel is building?"

    What would someone do? Speak out against it? Many countries have, but actions speak greater than words, and why would any country bother to take action?
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    and why would any country bother to take action?

    They won't, because they don't care. The suicide bombings have hurt the Palestinians more than they have hurt the Israelis. Palestinians have no credibility with the world now; Israel has tons.
    well, buddy, the native americans have been massacred and more or less wiped out in a genocidal fashion. The palestinians obviouly do not like being "forced...of thier land" and they are mad that "Israel will never give it back" so they are trying to regain it. They have not been completely wiped out, and they are fighting to make sure they wont be.

    Well, the Palestinians are fighting in the wrong way and thus are never going to get their land back as long as civilized countries remain in power. Their credibility is gone; no one cares. Government's can't support the Palestinian government with aid now because Hamas is in control and they are a terrorist group; thus there are laws prohibiting nations from giving money to terrorist groups. The Palestinian terrorists have only hurt themselves...
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  • guguruguguru 374 replies33 threads Member
    "Palestinians have no credibility with the world now."

    Even if they did have, who would care? Their arab brothers? They only attacked Israel at first because they didnt want the jews, and when they realized they couldnt beat israel they stopped. they refused to help the palestinians. The palestinians were more or less alone to begin with, and they were mad at the israelis not cause theyre jewish, but because they took thier land.

    "Government's can't support the Palestinian government with aid now because Hamas is in control and they are a terrorist group."

    That doesn't make sense, governments did not support them when they were not in control. They merely smuggled everything, and probably still will. And if a government did support them, what good would it do.


    btw, where are we going with this?
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  • Cuse0507Cuse0507 4404 replies115 threads Senior Member
    That doesn't make sense, governments did not support them when they were not in control. They merely smuggled everything, and probably still will. And if a government did support them, what good would it do.

    Not true. Before Hamas was elected into power, governments including the USA gave money directly to the Palestinian government. Now, we are prohibited by law from doing so. No loss to us, however.
    btw, where are we going with this?

    Absolutely nowhere...
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  • guguruguguru 374 replies33 threads Member
    "Not true. Before Hamas was elected into power, governments including the USA gave money directly to the Palestinian government. Now, we are prohibited by law from doing so. No loss to us, however."

    Yes, and the Fatah government was corrupt and did not do as much as it could have to help the people, which is why hamas won.

    "Absolutely nowhere..."

    hahaha
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