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How does one compare nursing programs and how if at all does ranking matter?

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Replies to: How does one compare nursing programs and how if at all does ranking matter?

  • greenwitchgreenwitch Registered User Posts: 8,170 Senior Member
    shawbridge - I'm joining the discussion late, but I've enjoyed reading the responses immensely! My D is also in nursing, a sophomore. She's currently wondering if she should switch to pre-med, but I have a feeling she'll stick with nursing. She's more of the ER or OR type, has the nerves for it and likes the adrenaline. She's also practical, and knows that with nursing, she has a much more flexible and changeable career. We have medical people in our family, some of whom seem to have painted themselves into a corner by being super-specialized and yet wanting to work part-time. You can't do that if you're the only specialist at a certain hospital and it means you're on call 24 hours a day, every day.

    A few more things to think about in your search - more prestigious hospital/colleges tend to have larger classes and you want to ask how many students go on rotation together during their clinicals, and whether they all get to cover each area. For any school, you'd want to how common it is to have to wait for a class and if that impedes graduating on time.

    Also, take those USNWR ratings with a big grain of salt. They're based ONLY on peer review, they look at no objective standards whatsoever.

    It's interesting that you see Canada as having a higher standard of living for the middle class. How much does their healthcare play into that? Is it a more secure field there because of the government being a single payer? I have a sister who lives in Scandinavia and I think it would be much harder here, for a single mom, to live comfortably. Mainly due to things like health care, public transportation and infrastructure and schools. Also, there is laughably little crime and even less poverty. Too bad about that long winter!
  • shawbridgeshawbridge Registered User Posts: 5,508 Senior Member
    greenwitch, Canada has pretty serious winters (except for the Vancouver area), but what I see is that a pretty high percentage of middle and upper middle class Canadians that I know have "cottages" on a lake (outside of Montreal, Toronto, Ottawa, etc.) and they go there religiously each weekend. Spending the weekend at the cottage (in the out of doors) is considered necessary and in a sense a right. Life is more balanced. Generally there is a stronger sense that life is not just about work.

    In the US, in our area at least, the folks who tend to be able to afford weekend houses don't have any time to go to them because they are working so hard. The US tends to be the best for people who want to be the best or very nearly the best in their field, whatever their field is. But for the other folks, Canada looks better to me.
  • greenwitchgreenwitch Registered User Posts: 8,170 Senior Member
    Here's a perfect counterpoint to the USNWR list of "best hospitals":


    Listing of top hospitals includes only one in the Washington area, Holy Cross - The Washington Post

    Hopkins does not make this list. To their credit they are humbled and vow to improve.
    “To not be listed in the top 405 hospitals, you can imagine, for Johns Hopkins, was quite startling, and we are absolutely redoubling our efforts to make sure we focus on these things,” said Peter Pronovost, Hopkins’s senior vice president for patient safety and quality.

    Here is the criteria for this list:
    Some other rating systems, he said, rely heavily on a hospital’s reputation or on outcomes, both of which are flawed measurement approaches, he said. A hospital’s reputation may have more to do with research capacity and “brand-new treatment opportunities for patients.”

    By contrast, the 22 specific measures identified by the commission are basic “bread-and-butter metrics,” he said. “They are not controversial. Everybody agrees they should be done.”
  • aglagesaglages Registered User Posts: 2,633 Senior Member
    greenwitch wrote:
    A few more things to think about in your search - more prestigious hospital/colleges tend to have larger classes and you want to ask how many students go on rotation together during their clinicals, and whether they all get to cover each area.
    Aren't the sizes of the clinical classes restricted by a certain ratio of students to instructors? IOTW - is it possible to have 30 students per instructor or are ALL clinical classes held to a maximum of say 12 to 1...or less? I disagree that the "more prestigious hospital/colleges tend to have larger classes". At least not larger clinical classes.
  • greenwitchgreenwitch Registered User Posts: 8,170 Senior Member
    Aglages - I meant classes in the larger sense, i.e. a nursing class of 200 rather than 50 (per year). In either case, you need to check on how many students are in a group during a clinical rotation. A group of 5 or 6 being better than a group of 10 to 12. Sorry that wasn't clear.
  • charlieschmcharlieschm Registered User Posts: 4,282 Senior Member
    Holy Family University is in northeast Phila. and has direct entry nursing. I just read an article that they are seeking to get control of a city-owned parcel near their main campus to add nursing dormitories and to build an assisted living facility that would provide convenient clinical experiences for their students.
  • charlieschmcharlieschm Registered User Posts: 4,282 Senior Member
    I don't know anything about the college referenced in the above post. However, please be very very careful of for-profit colleges. There are some good ones, but most are not. They often have very low graduation rates (data is available from the U.S. Dept. of Education), and extremely high student debt levels. Some have been known to direct students to very high interest rate private lenders, and to try to hide the true costs of those loans.

    Many for-profits exist mainly to soak up Pell grants, VA benefits and federal loans. Students at less reputable for-profits often find that their credits are not accepted by other colleges.

    Often the same education that is available at a for-profit college is available at a community college, for a fraction of the cost.

    One for-profit had 200 people working to recruit students, and only one employee to help the graduates find jobs. Another for-profit bought the name and assets of a nearly-bankrupt religious college and used that bankrupt college's accredition to issue a huge increase in the number of online degrees.

    The favorite trick is to claim "accredition" by an organization that sounds official. However, it may be a phony accredition organization that no one else recognizes.
  • charlieschmcharlieschm Registered User Posts: 4,282 Senior Member
    The ad was deleted. thanks, moderators.
  • mjaffsmjaffs Registered User Posts: 1 New Member
    Hi shwbridge...where did ur daughter decide to go...my sister is in a similar situation where i want her to come here to boston but she wants to study in ontario canda...she got accepted to many ontario schools but she does not know which one is better than the other do you have any inputs
  • shawbridgeshawbridge Registered User Posts: 5,508 Senior Member
    mjaffs, I have sent you a PM.
  • nancy211005nancy211005 Registered User Posts: 42 Junior Member
    @mjaffs‌ and @shawbridge‌ , any thoughts on Canadian Nursing pgms? My daughter is a dual citizen and she is applying to Western but wants to apply to more. I was thinking Ryerson. Need a safety in the bunch, as these schools require HIGH grades. Thanks!
  • shawbridgeshawbridge Registered User Posts: 5,508 Senior Member
    @nancy211005, my recollections are three plus years old. I spoke with a relative who taught nursing in BC and she told me that Queens, U of Toronto, Western and York were good and that Ryerson was very good but more hands-on. There were also a lot of schools that you could go to a nursing feeder program at a college that guaranteed you admission to a university to get your BSN. I think it was two years at the college and then two years at the university. One could be admitted to Ryerson directly or to George Brown or Centennial Colleges and automatically continue at Ryerson. I have the feeling that McMaster is good in health stuff generally but don't remember if it was on ShawD's radar screen.
  • nancy211005nancy211005 Registered User Posts: 42 Junior Member
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