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Oh man, this conservative radio host is really stupid

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Replies to: Oh man, this conservative radio host is really stupid

  • razorsharprazorsharp Registered User Posts: 6,161 Senior Member
    Mr. Payne, I feel sorry for you. Your parents must have really ignored you and females must think you're the biggest loser for being so rude and obnoxious.

    And I feel sorry for you s.dot. You don't seem capable of engaging in a discussion without calling a poster you have never met a bigot just because he or she disagrees with you. You really ad little to the discussion.
  • Yankee BelleYankee Belle Registered User Posts: 744 Member
    Poverty does play a part in how well kids do in school. But it doesn't take generations to improve one's situation. Look at how well Asian immigrants do. They come here with nothing and don't speak the language, yet their kids are far outperforming everyone. The reason is cultural. They stress education. Blacks and Hispanics not so much. More whites do stress education, than don't.
    It also goes to cultural behavior; illegitimacy and drug and alcohol abuse being the major ones. Oh, and can we please stop saying poverty causes crime? It doesn't. Being poor doesn't make you a thief or a thug. Being a thief usually makes you poor, unless you're Bernie Madoff or a politician.
  • DocTDocT Registered User Posts: 7,279 Senior Member
    "It is damn near impossible to break the poverty cycle, and generally takes many generations. Many hispanics have only been here a generation or two and are still trying to fight their way upward. Most whites have been here for many, many generations and have had time to establish themselves."

    It took many people of my grandparents generation (early 1900's )with zero education and no knowledge of the English language 1 generation to move into the middle class. Perhaps it was because you either learned English and skills or you starved as there were no safety nets in place.
  • s.dots.dot - Posts: 678 Junior Member
    Bullet, I'm supposed to believe it's a coincidence that Barack's critics would also be the one's suggesting that statistics show blacks, or any other race is inherently less intelligent than whites ... and not believe they're just being racist? C'mon, you don't think I'm that naive, do you? I certainly hop not, cause if you do it would suggest you are painfully lacking in the area of common sense. As usual, I'm going to say my piece then leave you to your illogical conclusions and rebuttals. I've got 5 exams or projects due next week, and although I'm comfortable with my intellectual capabilities, now is not the time for me to slack off to argue moot points with bigots:

    The entire argument is simply bogus because it's just ridiculous to not take into account all the variables that may MAKE IT SEEM AS IF one race is intellectually superior to another race. Cultural influences, priorities, history, access to intellectual material, socioeconomic position and the attitudes coming from the dominant culture towards ethnic minorities are all things that influence the diffusion of knowledge across ethnic lines.

    If one ethnic group places less of a premium on being (formally) educated, it has nothing to do with who's inherently more or less intelligent. Let's say Africans were to come here and start enslaving whites and shipping them over to Africa to perform free labor for hundreds of years. Throw in the same EXACT conditions — the rape, pillaging, beating, forbidding of all customs and religions, FORBIDDING THEM TO LEARN HOW TO READ ... all the terrorist-type treatment whites subjected blacks to during slavery. Keep those whites enslaved for the same length of time blacks were enslaved, UNDER THE SAME PHYSICAL AND MENTAL DURESS, and when they are finally "freed," set up the media, legal/government agencies, workforce and social organizations so as to minimize their socioeconomic development, and then see how damned smart they are. We wouldn't be having this discussion then, would we?

    If you're waiting to prove whites are inherently more intelligent than blacks, not only are you disgustingly evil and racist, you're also not too bright yourself, cause you're wasting your time. Keep listening to your sources. They'll continue to lead you down the path to iniquity.

    And razorsharp, why in the hell would you suggest I have to meet someone to suggest they're a racist when they have an entire posting history to go on? Brilliant, I tell ya ...
  • bulletandpimabulletandpima Registered User Posts: 9,826 Senior Member
    I agree with DocT. My great grandparents, Bullets great grandparents came over on a boat. Mine from Poland, his from Italy. My grandfather was 3 when his parents came here, he served as mayor of my hometown (exit 9) for almost 30 yrs. They spoke perfect English b/c my great grandparents tried to assimilate to America and that meant speaking English, they refused to speak Polish to my Mom and her siblings. The only thing they never learned to say in English was the prayer to the Priest for penance.

    Bullet's great grandparents did the same, they learned how to speak English by assimilating into society. In his family the granparents spoke both English and Italian, but my FIL does not speak one word of Italian, b/c the parents refused to speak to them in anything, but English.

    When I was a teacher in NC, on the 1st day of kindergarten for DS2, a little Japanes boy entered, his family only spoke Japanese, by the time he was in 2nd grade, you would never know that the family had only arrived in the US 2 yrs earlier. His sister graduated this yr and is now going to go to Duke. Another family that was unable to have their own children, adopted 3 siblings 5,7,9 from Ethiopia, within a yr they no longer had to attend ESOL, b/c they were up to speed. However, the girl I spoke of earlier attended ESOL for 10 yrs (all of elementary and middle) b/c neither of her parents tried to assimilate. Her mother would send in notes in spanish, that I would have to send over to the ESOL teacher to interpret. They never attended one Parent Teacher conference. They had the true belief that graduating from 4th grade was an accomplishment and education meant very little to them. The daughter remained in school only because it kept her from having to get a job, she openly stated that to me throughout her educational career. Even failing the gateway yrs was something she was happy about, because she would have to attend summer school and not have to work.
  • ConsolationConsolation Registered User Posts: 22,668 Senior Member
    I guess giving factual statistics is now beyond the realm of acceptable discourse.

    The problem is, he didn't actually cite any statistics or sources for such. He simply hurled accusations that he evidently believes are Conventional Wisdom.
  • ConsolationConsolation Registered User Posts: 22,668 Senior Member
    Inevitably they buy the older, smaller, worse home in the better school district than the brand spanking new bigger home which is cheaper in the worst school district. The only time they go with the latter is when they make the decision that they will send the kids to private, thus the school still isn't doing any better.

    I'm confused. Isn't buying a cheaper house in a better school district an indication of a desire to invest in educational opportunity?

    BTW, Pima, my father was the son of immigrants. (They were comfortable/very comfortable in their native country, but fairly poor here.) When he was little, they stopped speaking their native language in the home--they had learned English--so that when he entered school he would be a true native speaker. He was the val of his large public HS and received full scholarships to HY&P. I don't think he experienced any "loss" by his parents' decision to become Americans. I see no virtue in clinging to the language and culture of another country to the exclusion of becoming integrated into one's new country. I do see great advantage in being bilingual, if you can swing it.
  • bulletandpimabulletandpima Registered User Posts: 9,826 Senior Member
    Isn't buying a cheaper house in a better school district an indication of a desire to invest in educational opportunity?

    Yes it is, but the point is that continues the positive trend, whereas, the schools that are failing continue to fail because of that fact, thus the homes cost less and it becomes a socio-economic issue, where people place education below on the need to have list and that hurts the school. Parental involvement is the key. If parents don't care about the school, than they are placing the home above the education of their children...not a good sign.

    I also agree that being bilingual is great. I think it was a different generation then, falling under the realm of immersion. Now, I believe that most parents who are strong educational supporters elect to use their native language as a foot up for their children, but do not use it as a foundation within their own home.

    s.dot

    You want to use slavery as a basis for your arguement and why the socio-economic development lags for AA. How do you explain that my great grandparents came with no money, family and didn't speak, read or write English, 50 yrs after the Civil War, but their son became a mayor in our hometown? My family has no ties to slavery, but I am the enemy because of being white? If I have guessed it right, you are a college student, let's go on the idea you are 21, that means your great-great-great-great grandparent was born to parents that were enslaved, (assuming they all had kids at 21). Isn't it time to move on? When exactly will we as a society in your opinion be able to move on? BTW have you traced your family ancestry, do you know if they were slaves in America...if so that is way too cool!

    Also if you are saying that Mexican/Hispanics are coming here for a better life, I agree, but if they truly want a better life than learn how to assimilate, learn English, don't take the easy way out. You chose, just like my grandparents to come here, you had to know it would be hard, especially if you are illegal.
  • tom1944tom1944 Registered User Posts: 6,018 Senior Member
    bandp- was it Milltown?
  • DocTDocT Registered User Posts: 7,279 Senior Member
    By the way - my grandparents didn't know how to read or write in their native language - they never went to school.
  • bulletandpimabulletandpima Registered User Posts: 9,826 Senior Member
    NO but very very close! I use to go into Milltown for Pizza,, and my grandpop was the one that actually lent money to open it. It truly is a dive, but the pizza is the best! I also know Milltown real well because we went to the Lions for Gyros and Beers!

    My Dad's family and my grandfathers family both owned farms on Riva (or is it Reva)

    Bullet lived about 2 minutes from Milltown, right off of Ryders Lane!

    What the heck, it was EB, he was Mayor from the late 1920's to the early 60's. I am incredibly proud of him, he created the vol. f.d., ambulance, and police. AND GRANDPOP WAS A DEM! He decided to retire in the 60's, to ths day he is the longest serving mayor of EB, and when he died in 1983, he was the longest serving mayor in NJ, it now belongs to somebody in Middlesex that has served more than 40 yrs (2006)!

    Tom out of curiosity why did you chose Milltown? EB is exit 9(he was mayor and involved with that) and 8A! If you know EB, you will find his last name, his wife's name, son, and 3 daughters all named on streets near each other. They also named a street for him and their first son in SR. My uncle lives on the street named after him, they gave my gpop a lot as a wedding present for my uncle when he married my aunt, she was from SR!

    Off track, I remember being taught in school that in the 30's Milltown had the highest rate of the KKK in NJ! That freaked me out!
  • ConsolationConsolation Registered User Posts: 22,668 Senior Member
    pima wrote:
    When exactly will we as a society in your opinion be able to move on?

    I'd say when people casually note that someone has dark skin the way they currently note that someone has red hair.

    I would observe that we have actually made HUGE progress in that direction during my lifetime.

    While I agree that clinging to outrage and blame is not the way for African Americans to move forward, I also think that it is disingenuous to claim that being a European immigrant was or is the same level of "social handicap" as having black skin. The South did not have LAWS that prevented Poles and Italians from using certain public facilities, although it--and other regions--undeniably did have idle prejudice. You cannot simply glance at a person and identify them as an Eastern European.
  • Yankee BelleYankee Belle Registered User Posts: 744 Member
    s.dot - how many generations after the slavery and raping and beating end do you think it would take that group of white people to see that education will improve their condition?

    I don't believe that any race is inherently smarter than any other. Some cultural groups do indeed place more value on education than others and unfortunately too many American Blacks have been using slavery as an excuse to not better themselves individually and collectively. Immigrant blacks, as a group certainly do better than American Blacks, with the handicap of actually having lived a much more difficult life and not speaking English. I believe it is cultural, and American Blacks have not really embraced education. 'Acting White,' is a perfect example of the scorn held for black kids who want to get an education.
  • minimini Registered User Posts: 26,431 Senior Member
    "Look at how well Asian immigrants do. They come here with nothing and don't speak the language, yet their kids are far outperforming everyone."

    Stereotypes, again. Look at how Hmong and Mien immigrants are doing. Which Asians are we talking about? Pakistanis? Uyghurs? Mongolians? Koreans? Malaysian Tamils? Burmese?
    Afghanis? Kazakhs?
  • klugekluge Registered User Posts: 6,559 Senior Member
    I don't see anything "conservative" about this guy's comments. The fact that American conservatives have made a Faustian political pact with racists and xenophobes like this buffoon so that now everyone just sort of lumps them together is just kind of.... sad.
This discussion has been closed.