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Betsy DeVos statement on historically black colleges and universities


Replies to: Betsy DeVos statement on historically black colleges and universities

  • marvin100marvin100 Registered User Posts: 9,024 Senior Member
    I am not convinced that beyond the first few years, additional experience adds much value to an essentially identical job.

    As a career educator and child of two career educators who was raised on a campus where every adult I knew until I was 18 was a teacher, I strongly disagree.
  • fretfulmotherfretfulmother Registered User Posts: 1,853 Senior Member
    Particularly (re experience mattering) - because I don't see each year teaching as an "essentially identical job" - sometimes, people see something like "L.A. Law" and think they know how to be a lawyer...this is precisely what we're seeing when a layperson thinks they really understand what it takes to be a teacher because they saw Mrs. Krabappel on the Simpsons. :)

    Also, re what @cobrat said, even if something is closer to being "essentially identical" (say, being a plumber or pilot) - I'd sure want to hire the more experienced one!

    (I say closer to being identical not out of disrespect to pilots or plumbers, but because by nature mechanical things are closer to being identical than human beings are.)
  • TooOld4SchoolTooOld4School Registered User Posts: 3,005 Senior Member
    edited March 2017
    @cobrat, no because those jobs are constantly evolving with a wealth of new material, new products, new customers, evolving relationships, additional responsibilities and procedural and technological upgrades. You can't say that teaching Algebra II changes very much when you teach a set of new kids every year of the same basic age and ability.

    And I was referring to the learning curve. The vast majority of learning in a particular task takes place at the very beginning. Do you deliver more value in year 1 vs year 20? You could argue that the sales rep for sold $500K in year 1 and $20M in year 20 did. Or the software developer who worked on a higher value project did. Or a pilot who flies a 787 instead of an Beechcraft did. I don't think you could make the same case for a public school teacher who is delivering a similar service in year 1 vs year 20.
  • marvin100marvin100 Registered User Posts: 9,024 Senior Member
    Hear, hear, @fretfulmother !
  • cobratcobrat Registered User Posts: 12,285 Senior Member
    ^ ^

    Methinks a FB friend who suggested IHOP and other breakfast places run a special presidential promotion on waffles was onto something....
  • Capecodder2014Capecodder2014 Registered User Posts: 99 Junior Member
    @fretfulmother My wish for public education is that every student have a teacher as smart, literate and thoughtful as you. I have no doubt that you improve with every year of experience (claims to the opposite are absolutely mind-boggling).
  • fretfulmotherfretfulmother Registered User Posts: 1,853 Senior Member
    @Capecodder2014 - thank you so much!! What a kind and generous thing to say. :)
  • BobShawBobShaw Registered User Posts: 158 Junior Member
    @fretfulmother and @marvin100 and @cobrat - As a high tech guy who has seen his corporate income grow significantly from year 1 to year X, I back you up 110%. Why? Because my wife is a public school teacher, and she absolutely deserves every raise her union is lucky enough to negotiate in their contract. I am astonished by the ignorance of a society that neither understands nor values the work of a teacher. And this is exactly why teachers' unions must continue to exist. Yes, they have their faults. Yes, they can sometimes obstruct progress and reform. Yes, some of my children's teachers (and wife's colleagues) should have been ousted a long time ago, had it not been for the current tenure practices. But without these protections, people like those running the current administration would make sure teachers get slave wages for their labor. And clueless administrators and crazy parents would make teachers' lives a living hell. I didn't understand these things until my wife entered the field of education. Now I know, and I am a staunch advocate.
  • fretfulmotherfretfulmother Registered User Posts: 1,853 Senior Member
    Thanks @BobShaw! Your wife (and all of us) are lucky to have articulate advocates like you in the "real world"! :)
This discussion has been closed.