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Something very scary and very wrong is happening

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Replies to: Something very scary and very wrong is happening

  • momofthreeboysmomofthreeboys Registered User Posts: 15,419 Senior Member
    You learn something everyday.
  • MomofJandLMomofJandL Registered User Posts: 1,170 Senior Member
    You learn something everyday.
    Only if you listen to things you haven't heard before. Some people go years without learning anything.
  • collegedad13collegedad13 Registered User Posts: 521 Member
    I particularly try to not learn a bunch of garbage every day like "medicare is doomed to effect a net harm on society" or "social security is bad"
  • marvin100marvin100 Registered User Posts: 9,014 Senior Member
    hebegebe wrote:
    Since early in this thread you stated you were against Murray, which of his books have you read and what specifically did you find wrong about them?

    I read The Bell Curve and have followed the scholarship on it extensively. I've even taught it and many related tests.

    I'm not going to argue that awful book and its totally shoddy "scholarship" on this message board, though--there's a very large corpus available that has very thoroughly dismantled it (which is one reason its author shouldn't be welcomed in academia).
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,722 Senior Member
    For anyone still following this thread, Allison Stanger had an op-ed in the nytimes.
  • collegedad13collegedad13 Registered User Posts: 521 Member
    Parts of the op ed are very good. From the op ed

    "It is obvious that some protesters made dangerous choices. But with time to reflect, I have to say that I hear and understand the righteous anger of many of those who shouted us down. I know that many students felt they were standing up to protect marginalized people who have been demeaned or even threatened under the guise of free speech."
  • hebegebehebegebe Registered User Posts: 1,850 Senior Member
    @collegedad13,

    Since you read the article, how did you miss this gem:
    Intelligent members of the Middlebury community — including some of my own students and advisees — concluded that Charles Murray was an anti-gay white nationalist from what they were hearing from one another, and what they read on the Southern Poverty Law Center website. Never mind that Dr. Murray supports same-sex marriage and is a member of the courageous “never Trump” wing of the Republican Party.

    In other words, Stanger believes that the SPLC paints an intentionally misleading portrait of Murray. This is one of the references you cited as why Murray is a racist. You also gave me a quote from the SPLC site that suggested that Murray was in league with eugenicists, when in fact I showed you that the quote was taken completely out of context.

    So, are you now really angry at the SPLC for manipulating your view about Murray, or are you simply so anchored in your view that it doesn't matter what falsehoods are spread, as long as you agree with the outcome?
  • collegedad13collegedad13 Registered User Posts: 521 Member
    @hebegebe You need to stop with the personal attacks. It is really annoying and not appropriate
    So, are you now really angry at the SPLC for manipulating your view about Murray, or are you simply so anchored in your view that it doesn't matter what falsehoods are spread, as long as you agree with the outcome?
  • hebegebehebegebe Registered User Posts: 1,850 Senior Member
    You are right @collegedad13, I was over the line in the paragraph you quoted. For that, I apologize.
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    edited March 13
    Well I would like to hold the Middlebury students who disrupted the event to that same standard.
  • marvin100marvin100 Registered User Posts: 9,014 Senior Member
    @HarvestMoon1 - the protestors or whoever it was that pulled the professor's hair? Because the first sounds a lot like free speech to me, and the latter, well, nobody here has argued that the assailant should not be punished.
  • hebegebehebegebe Registered User Posts: 1,850 Senior Member
    I'm not going to argue that awful book and its totally shoddy "scholarship" on this message board, though--there's a very large corpus available that has very thoroughly dismantled it (which is one reason its author shouldn't be welcomed in academia).
    I am happy to have someone who opposes Murray and has actually read his work. But your lack of reasons why are disappointing. You attribute it to his work being so widely discredited that it is simply not worth your time.

    Because if Charles Murray's work is so thoroughly discredited in academia, why do you think that he was defended by 52 academics for the work in The Bell Curve? And long after The Bell Curve, why was he still getting articles published in peer-reviewed journals, including more articles on race and IQ?

    Is it instead possible that you find his position so distasteful that you take the positions of people that criticize his work and accept that to mean his work is widely discredited, when in fact everyone's work is criticized?
  • marvin100marvin100 Registered User Posts: 9,014 Senior Member
    I'm sure Middlebury is dealing with its student policy violations as it sees fit. This site enforces its ToS as it sees fit as well. If the two have different policies or different enforcement methods, well, that doesn't indicate any contradiction or (*gasp*!) hypocrisy, though.
This discussion has been closed.