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Interesting perspective on sexual assault remedies

Ohiodad51Ohiodad51 Registered User Posts: 2,243 Senior Member
edited August 12 in Parent Cafe
http://www.nationalreview.com/article/450415/taylor-swift-groping-trial-lessons-title-ix-sexual-assault

If some of you can get by the fact it is written by a man and in an unabashedly conservative magazine, there is an interesting point here.
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Replies to: Interesting perspective on sexual assault remedies

  • romanigypsyeyesromanigypsyeyes Registered User Posts: 32,789 Senior Member
    Nice idea but not every victim can afford lawyers and everything else that goes into a civil case.
  • HannaHanna Registered User Posts: 14,240 Senior Member
    The author overlooks the fact that the alleged butt-grabber was summarily fired based on the accusation alone. The litigation came afterwards. The problem is that employers can summarily fire people, and schools usually don't (and shouldn't) summarily expel students.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,722 Senior Member
    I thought the author's argument was victims could sue in civil court for damages and college disciplinary proceedings could be based on the results of those trials or settlements.
  • beth's mombeth's mom Registered User Posts: 3,361 Senior Member
    The civil court docket is very full in some jurisdictions, and cases can take a long time to be resolved. What happens while a case is slogging its way through the court system? Are the college disciplinary proceedings at a standstill? Is the accused allowed to continue in school?
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    edited August 12
    Swift was not the one who sued here. She was initially satisfied with her mother's report of the incident to his employer.

    After the termination Mueller sued Swift, her mother and I believe the person who fired him. Swift counterclaimed against him only after he sued her for damages for his termination. The judge just dismissed her as a defendant, but I believe allowed her counterclaim to stand. I think the reasoning was that it was her mother who reported the incident and his employer who fired him. Although I haven't seen the decision I assume the judge felt Mueller had no cause of action against Swift.
  • techmom99techmom99 Registered User Posts: 1,854 Senior Member
    @romanigypsyeyes -

    Most civil cases are taken on a contingency basis by the plaintiff's attorney. In the US, each party pays its own costs and if you lose as a plaintiff, you don't owe your attorney anything. It's the defendants who have to pay for attorneys, although in many civil cases, a defendant's attorney fees and costs are paid by their insurance company.
  • cobratcobrat Registered User Posts: 12,285 Senior Member
    Most civil cases are taken on a contingency basis by the plaintiff's attorney. In the US, each party pays its own costs and if you lose as a plaintiff, you don't owe your attorney anything. It's the defendants who have to pay for attorneys, although in many civil cases, a defendant's attorney fees and costs are paid by their insurance company.

    Not completely free. There are fees which may not be covered under contingency and there's the substantial costs in the form of substantial time expended in preparing for and waging a civil suit case...or even waiting for it to be tried which could result in lost opportunity costs, wages, and mental stress of having to undergo what can be an ordeal for many.

    Those factors are often used by the opposing side....especially those with substantial wealth/leverage to encourage a settlement which reduces their losses and often includes a clause not admitting any guilt for wrongdoing.
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    edited August 12
    How would one calculate damages on sexual harassment or sexual assault from the alleged victim's perspective? And it would not then be a Title IX claim either.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,722 Senior Member
    ^That's not a new issue. Courts have been awarding damages in sexual assault claims for a long time. One issue is many states have caps on non-economic compensatory damages, which sometimes apply in sexual assault cases.
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    I have seen employment cases under Title VII stemming from workplace sexual harassment. There might also be cases where a victim sues for damages due to emotional distress or physical injury after the perpetrator has already been convicted in criminal court.

    A campus Title IX case from the victim's perspective is based upon them being deprived of the opportunity to get an education. Their remedy is having that impediment removed or alleviated so they can have the educational opportunity.

    Can you point me to some cases? Maybe they exist, I am just not familiar with them. Remember we are talking about Title IX campus assault cases here.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,722 Senior Member
    edited August 12
    ^I think the author in the link was proposing an alternative framework to Title IX, so new legislation that would effectively outsource the job of the Title IX panels to civil courts.
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    edited August 12
    But that would not change an alleged victim's right to proceed with a Title IX hearing at the university level. Universities have an interest in adjudicating these cases -- the responsibility of campus safety and enforcement of their conduct code lies with them.

    ETA: I think the author is confused. Swift didn't originate the litigation.
  • HarvestMoon1HarvestMoon1 Registered User Posts: 6,031 Senior Member
    This thread seems as good as any to raise the issue of Ezekiel Elliot. His girlfriend accused him of physical abuse. I believe she reported it to the police but they declined to prosecute basically stating there were "conflicting" narratives.

    The NFL conducted their own investigation pursuant to the NFL's Conduct Code. Yesterday they suspended him. From what I can tell the decision was reached with no input from him whatsoever. He did not even get a hearing --only gets one if he wants to appeal.

    Seems to me many entities besides universities adjudicate offenses under their conduct codes. We don't seem to get the same push back though.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 1,722 Senior Member
    ^Ezekiel Elliott was suspended for six games, not even an entire season. Although analogies aren't exact, a comparable punishment for a college student might be having to withdraw for the rest of the semester and then being allowed to return to school the following semester.
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