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First Harvard, then Pomona (meme group)

13

Replies to: First Harvard, then Pomona (meme group)

  • maya54maya54 Registered User Posts: 2,099 Senior Member
    edited October 2017
    I should add that the extent to which harassment in the form of pure speech can be considered unprotected has not been fully explored by the courts except with respect to High School students who do not have full First Amendment rights. Given that on First Amendment issues liberal and conservative justices often align (in an especially unusual manner with regards to US Supreme Court justices) the expectation by many attorneys who practice in this area is that Should this issue ever be fully put to the test the Court will very narrowly define harassment to something akin to a direct threat.
  • roethlisburgerroethlisburger Registered User Posts: 2,766 Senior Member
    @tonymom

    It's the political appointees, the Joint Chiefs, and the CSAF/VCSAF who truly set the tone and direction. The Citadel isn't an academy and isn't run by the military. If your relatives attended more than 3 years, almost the entire top leadership level at the Pentagon would have been replaced by now.
  • tonymomtonymom Registered User Posts: 1,172 Senior Member
    I'd argue we all set the tone in the ways we deal with others in our daily lives be they professional or personal. You seem to be missing the larger point I'm making here. The behavior was called out. Does it really matter who made the decision to do it? It's important it was done. Big cheese or little cheese we all make a difference or idly sit by and condone vile behavior....
  • CorinthianCorinthian Registered User Posts: 1,838 Senior Member
    http://tsl.news/news/6906/ Pomona says meme page is protected speech; will not investigate.
  • CorinthianCorinthian Registered User Posts: 1,838 Senior Member
    Here's an article that quotes the entire letter sent out by the Dean of Students explaining the decision. http://claremontindependent.com/no-sanctions-memes-college-says/
  • jonrijonri Registered User Posts: 7,387 Senior Member
    I'm less liberal than most people on this board.

    I took a look at some of the memes and while they were tasteless, I'd be appalled if someone was disciplined for them.
    IMO, the Harvard ones were a heck of a lot worse.

  • tonymomtonymom Registered User Posts: 1,172 Senior Member
    I had a student tell me it was his "freedom of speech" to say in class "those who don't speak English aren't American". I reminded him his rights don't allow him to create a hostile learning environment for others and that we respect each other. He's 12 yrs old. I have worked in education for quite some time and while kids often do say unkind things to one another there is certainly a new "feel" to this sort of bully behavior.
  • maya54maya54 Registered User Posts: 2,099 Senior Member
    edited October 2017
    The article links to Pamona' s First Amendment compliant policy which shows just how little " Hate Speech" can be subject to discipline (for public universities and California privates)

    As the policy states Verbal abuse, threats, intimidation, or harassment in the form of speech is not subject to disciple unless


    1) the speech is directed at an individual and

    2)
    actually used in an abusive manner in a situation that presents an actual danger that it will cause an immediate breach of the peace by inciting a violent reaction by the individual to whom the speech is addressed

    Or

    is offensive to the individual complaining of harassment and offensive to a reasonable person and so persistent, repetitive, pervasive, or severe that it has the purpose or effect of substantially interfering with an individual’s academic or professional performance or creating an intimidating, abusive or hostile educational, employment or living environment at the College.

    The memes which were intended to be shared only among like minded individuals do not qualify.

    It's intersting to note that Stanford could not do what Harvard did!
  • LinuskyLinusky Registered User Posts: 44 Junior Member
    Memes are suppose to be laughed at... It was never created for people to take seriously in the first place. I don't see why people are paying attention to memes so much. Oh by the way, hate speech = speech you disagree. If it is a conservative view back with real facts, then it is not hate speech. Because facts don't care about your feelings. Students should be able to debate and be allowed to openly express their views for our societies to progress. If you think a disagreeing view is hate speech, then you are a fascist. A TRUE FASCIST.
  • ZinheadZinhead Registered User Posts: 2,610 Senior Member
    I reminded him his rights don't allow him to create a hostile learning environment for others and that we respect each other.

    By that definition, any speech can be censored.
  • intparentintparent Registered User Posts: 36,891 Senior Member
    I'd have had him read the Constitution to find that particular item.
  • bluemamabluemama Registered User Posts: 13 New Member
    So I wrote to Pomona admissions because my daughter is considering applying there and got the usual stilted attorney-approved language. I have no problem with free speech and I'm not looking to see 19 year old heads roll. Indulge in tasteless, bad-mannered "humor" designed to belittle or manifest contempt for marginalized and powerless populations and karma and the good Lord will deal with you sooner or later. But what I can't seem to get from Pomona is an acknowledgement that this must be causing some anxiety and stress to their students of color and the LGBTQA community. If my daughter (we are African-American) found out her roommate was a member of that group, she would be upset to say the least. And I would be sick about it. I send my kid all the way across the country and this is what she's living with? So what are they doing for those kids? Does anybody know?
  • PragmaticMomPragmaticMom Registered User Posts: 366 Member
    I don’t think Pomona has a good answer to your question @bluemama . The effort to paint political correctness as a public menace has been very successful. We live in an Orwellian world. We are led to believe that being “politically correct” is unpatriotic and shameful. Meanwhile, being a racist or a homophobe is courageous and heroic, as if defending the indefensible is itself a noble act. Pomona is simply doing its best to avoid being called “politically correct” which is today a badge of shame.
  • bluemamabluemama Registered User Posts: 13 New Member
    edited November 2017
    Thanks for your response, PragmaticMom. That's sad though. To me political correctness is just about offering others the respect of addressing them as they choose to identify themselves. It's just what good humans do. Disappointed in Pomona and a few other institutions. Guess I'll leave it to my child to decide.
This discussion has been closed.